World History

Lost Lands 3 - Tartessos & Schera/Phaeacia

2007-07-27T23:44:00.000+01:00

Tartessos:
Ancient/traditional sources claim tartessos was beyond the Pillars of H, and that the river Guadalquivir/Baetis was prev called Tartessos river (2 mouthed [perhaps confluence/sources, island in]), and city Gades (or Carpia) prev called Tartessos.
The tribe name Turdetani in vicinity prob related. Berlitz says cyclopean ruins found at Niebla, Ronda and Huelva. (I read on some web/net forum that someone had found features in a swamp/marsh/bog that could match layout of Tartessos, but I lost the info.)
However, there is an intriguing if unlikely similarity with Tortosa near the mouth of the Ebro river (or Tarraconensis?), and perhaps king Arganthonius (&/or Gargoris) connected with name Aragon (or El-Argar)?
Alternative similar names: Tejo/Tagus, Tinto, Carteia, Tetouan, (Tardenois in sw France,) Zaragosa, etc.
Graves says Tartessos was west (cp Tartarus, Hesperides), and Salmydessus was east (cp Colchis), like Iranian Salm/Sayrima (Solymites/Sarmatians?) and Tur(ia); (there were Pillars of Hercules at west/Gibraltar and east/Dardanelles/Troy.)
The (not definately identified/located) ancient Hittite place name Tarhuntassa (Taurus, Tarsus?) is very similar to Tartessos.

Schera/Phaeacia:
Could the Schera/Phaeacia that Odyseus visited in the Odysey be Skara Brae (Orkneys)/Faroes (Fairy/Fay)?
Spanuth says Schera was: in Ocean, in North(?), at end/remotest, at mouth of great river.
Although unlikely perhaps the great river is the North/Baltic seas?
Alternative similar names might incld: sakkara, jerez (s spain), sicily, sir/serica/sherpa (china/tibet); basques, fezzan, phaistos, phasis (colchis), pict.
Evidence of egyptians/phoenicians (ships) in ancient Brit Isles eg http://www.geocities.com/futhark_runes/SkaraBrae_AncientEgyptianSettlement.html.

Atlantis (Lost Lands 2)

2007-06-24T02:22:00.000+01:00

Mythos Atlantis - Historia Pangaea,
by 'Ro-fhessa' V Sean W Bambrough.

Around 1999 I made my own analytical/deductive study to determine if Atlantis/Poseidonis existed and/or rather where. I considered everywhere around the world including all the theories I knew of or had (and since) encountered my self (tho there are far more than ones I know details about):

Crete, Thera/Santorini, Troy (Zangger), Tartessos, Bimini (Cayce), Heligoland (Spanuth), fiction/meta-physical (de Champ, Alford), planet X (Alford), nw Africa, Cyprus (Sarmast, [Urantia]), Ubar (Deyo), Albania (net), Athens, mid-Atlantic ([Scott-Eliot], Bellamy, Donnelly), pre-flood (Fasold), [Tiahuanaco (Fasold)], America, Atalante (de Camp), Tantalis, Indonesia (Santos, [Jantsang]), Australia, Antarctica (Flem-Ath, Hancock), Maldives/Laccadives (Hancock), [Pangaea ([Fasold?])], in sth Amer country (Prime tv).

Atlantis was in Ocean not Sea:
- Plato says Atlantis was in real/true outer/open ocean not in inner sea.
- was in atlantic, (herodotus called).
- Was opposite/beyond/outside Pillars of Hercules.
- (The S (& W) hemisphere has majority/emphasises unity of the oceans.)
- The biblical Great Sea and Egyptian Great Green may have been Atlantic incld Mediterranean ("Great Green poss suggests existence of another different coloured, smaller sea.")
- Plato treated as sep land-mass from Eur/As/Afr.
- Can't be too close (&/or far) in place (&/or time) to Athens/Sais.

Atlantis was a Continent not only an Island/City:
- Plato said Atlantis was an ISland the size of/larger than Asia & Libya combined ("roughly same size as USA/Antarctica/[Australia/face of Moon/Pluto]", Flem-Ath.)
- Not a needle in haystack as Hancock put it.
- Theopompus said Meropis was larger than Europe, Asia and Libya.
- Herodotus said Europe was as long as Asia & Libya put together & its breadth (euros) is not even comparable with them (though in another place he also says Asia & Europe are the same size/shape).
- Atlantis totally disappeared without any trace (except "mud").
- All of the details of the Atlantis account seem in general agree with Atlantis being a continent not an "island/city (+ empire)".
- Ancient writer mentions tradition of 7 islands and a (very) larger one that ruled over them in the Atlantic.
- Island in Bible, ancient Egypt, etc can mean either island, coastland/sealands, continent, peninsula, (pangaea, planet).
- Plato treated as separate land mass from Old World.
- population of Atlantis large (as est from military data etc).
- many animal species of Atl Account.

Atlantis/Poseidonis was in Atlantic/(Arctic) not in Indian, Pacific, (Arctic,) Antarctic, Oceanus:
- (was in Atlantic,) Herodotus called Atlantic before Plato (though after Solon).
- [4 divs/parts of oceanus?]
- Evidence is that there are no sunken/submerged continental island masses in Atlantic (Hancock), Indian (Jantsang)*, Arctic (submarines), Antarctic (geophysics) and/or Pacific (orthodox scientists)* oceans.
- Atlantis can't have been too far/close (incl "up/down" re Antarctica) from Greece/Egypt (Incendium).
- Lemuria unlike Atlantis/Mu was only a theory for oddities now better explained by Gondwanaland.
- S (&W) hemisphere has majority/emphasises unity of oceans re Atlantic/Poseidon/Oceanus.

Atlantis must be one of modern Continents not Oceans:
- Present oceanographic/geophysical evidence is that there are no sunken/submerged continents/land masses in the Atlantic, Indian*, Arctic (subs), Antarctic (geophys), and/or Pacific* oceans except for the true continental edges, shelves, islands and seas, and except for continental shift. (orthodox theory/"dogma" rejects/disclaims (wholly) rising/sinking continents, except for (limited) submergence/exposure by rising/droping sea-levels theory/evidence.)
- (Seemingly no evidence that the continents ever wholly/permanently below sea level? except for )
- Maps that use true continental edges don't show significantly large enough gaps in the Atlantic between Eur/Afr and Amers when orig joint together to fit Atlantis into (excepting lakes, ridges, islands, sub-continents/plates)?
- All evidence of lost continents of Atl/Lemuria is more readily explained by continental drift theory.
- According to Ockam's razor there is no need to assume the existence of any more continents than the 7 we presently know of?
- (All the oceans are from (indirectly) one original Pan-Ocean; all the oceans are part of one Oceanus.)
- Old World traditions of Atlantis/etc in west and New World traditions of [Mu]/etc in east could be respectively/relatively refering to each other, or commonly to [shifted] land in between (Armorica plate).

Atlantis was in Atlantic but was not the Atlantic;
Atlantis was a continent/large island but not a sunken/submerged one.

Atlantis was in the west (and north) not east (and south):
- Atlanteans conquered upto Tyrrhenia & Libya from (N)W.
- Atlantis is always said to be in western sea. (Cp Hesperides.)
- Spanuth gives evidence that Atlantis was in the north (Hyperborea, Sea Peoples).
- Despite the ancient records of reversal of compass points a couple of times in history, the Egyptians/Arabs were seemingly the only odd ones out in (sometimes) placing south as up/reverse west-east (Deyo/Flem-Ath/Massey, Jantsang)?
- Atlantis can't have been too far/close incl "up/down" from/to Greece/Egypt (Incendium).
- Hyperborea/Tartarus/Thule in NW or NE.
- The Aryan Barbarians always came from the north (Greek, Indian, Iranian, Egyptian, Sumerian, Polynesian, Aztec, biblical.)
- W hemisphere majority of oceans (vs E hem.)
- N hem majority of continents (size).

Atlantis was America(s) or Armorica (Plate) not Europe, Asia, Africa, Australia, Antarctica, "8th Continent/Atlantis", pangaea:
- Antarctica is 2 islands not continent (depend on sea level).
- Plato treated Atlantis as a separate land-mass from Eur & As/As & Lib/Lib & Eur.
- size.
- Atlantis can't have been too far/close distance/duration incl "up/down" from Greece/Egypt (Incendium).
- Atlantis was in western sea/opposite Pillars of Hercules.
- Atlanteans conquered upto Tyrrhennia & Libya from (N)W.
- Atlantis can not be dry land based theories.
- No mention in account of crossing equator.
- No archaelogical finds of humans/civilisation in Antarctica yet?.
- No hints on Piri Reis map of civ/humans/Atlantis in Antarctica?
- "Atlantis has been identified/connected with every continent except Australia" except for by one writer.
- Some of "Atlantis" locations not (too) far (enough) from Old World to be lost/not to be found.
- N (&E) hemisphere has majority/emphasises unity of continents (re Atlantis).
- Atantis climate conducive to 2 crops a year (not Antarctic).
- North Pole was once in Canada/Greenland (re Hyperborea/Sea Peoples/Keftiou).
- Americas had all animals implied in Atlantis account incl elephants/mastodons, camels, horses, sabre tooth tigers, sloths.
- Alleghenies/Appalachians could have been Atlas/Nthern Pillar.
(- Scientists theorise Amerinds came via Berring but almost exclusively all Indians own oral memories say they came from east over sea.
- First Americans were like Cro-Magnons in Europe (Otamid, Folsom, Big Game Hunters, MacKenzie High Arctic high culture, Archaic Caucasoids, Kennewick man); and Cro-Magnons were (flat faced?) like Amerinds.
- My theory explains Archaic Maritime culture in ancient America, (ref Barry Fell).
- (Egyptian pictures of some Sea Peoples look American to me? (Cp Geronimo?))
- Assyrian pictures of Tjekker sea peoples bearing South American fan palm, ref Fitzgerald-Lee.)

elephants:
now only indian/asian & african, but americas had them (& mastodons) in "prehistory".
mammoths (eg siberia). Spanuth found tusk/s at Heligoland. Hannibal. elephant from aleph "ox" accord to some scholars. Ivory tusks from/via Keftiou.

whole world/global not old world/known world/inhabited world/inner sea/Asia-Africa/local/flat :
- Herodotus said his contemporaries were wrong that the world consisted of (only) Europe, Asia and Libya.
- Popul Vuh says first race of men "examined 4 pts of horizon & round surface/circles of the earth & the 4 pts of the firmament/heaven."
- Maps such as Piri Reis (Hapgood), Kirchir, Ptolemy (Sitchin).
- Finds of ancient ships &/or drawings of (cp Heyerdahl).
- Satan wandered to & fro, up & down in [all] the earth (Job).
- Pyramidology geographical facts about Great Pyramid.
- knew was sphere (circle/disk/ring/hemisphere/dome/quadrants/arc/egg).
- Plato said Atlantis was larger than Libya & Asia combined, and treated it (& opposite continent) as separate landmass from Libya & Asia/Asia & Europe/Europe & Libya.
- Herodotus' statement that oceans/seas all parts of one Ocean, and Plato's distinguishing between real/true outer ocean and inner seas/indentations ("theory") parallels modern geopolitical worldview.
- plato said that known world contracted.
- Proofs of links between ancient/prehistoric Americas and Old World (above, refs Heyerdahl, Honore, N Davies, B Fell, Scott-Elliot).
- ancients' world projected & (sub-)divided into # of continents/latitudes/hemispheres/worlds/quadrants/[hours] like we do.

It is claimed the Pillars of Hercules/Melkart at Gibraltar were late(r), and there were earlier Pillars at Troy &/or ....
In fact there were 12 Pillars of Herakles acc to 1/some source/s at least.
The Atl acct seems to indicate that the Gibraltar ones are meant.

Atlantis sinking/submergence can not have been (just) Great Flood (confounded), submerged by rising sea levels at end ice age, tidal wave/slosh, earth crust displacement, volcanic eruption or literally sunk, but rather Atlantis (genuinely appeared to have sunk when it really continentally) shifted away:
- Only Atlantis (and Athens) lost not whole world [re flood/rising sea levels/crust displacement].
- Must have both quake(s) and flood(s) [re flood*/ris sea levs].
- Would not have made distance/duration that much longer for ancients not to be able to find Atlantis any longer [re ris sea levs].
- Atlantis totally disappeared (locally/regionally) without any trace (except "mud") [re ris sea levs/tid wav/volc erupt/lit sunk/displac].
- The land would still be not absolutely lost but still possible to find down below underwater [re ris sea levs/lit sunk].
- Account says sunk not (just?) sea level rise (~flood(s)?)
- Atlantis was already separate island mass but in bible continents didn't split til Peleg/Babel/Flood [re flood].
- No rain/fountains great deep in Atlantis account.
- Evidence is that there are no sunken/submerged continental island masses in Atlantic (Hancock), Indian (Jantsang), Arctic (sumarines), Antarctic (geophysics), Pacific (orthodox scientists).
- Erroneous dates Atlantis and end last Ice Age only coincidence/theory (see below).
- No large enough gaps between Americas and Old World when they were joint together to fit Atlantis into?
- Evidence for old sunken/submerged continents of Atl/Lemuria theories more readily explained by continental shift.
- Cp sink >11km, or 1km submerged true cont shelf, to shift ca 2000km.
- If sea levels were lower Gibraltar straits would be land.
- Mid-Atlantic is emerging up/out not down/in.

9000/8000 yrs date:
is def not (wholly) literal incld because Atlantis can't have been too far (or near) in time (or place) from (or to) Athens, Sais, etc. greek culture of account said to match mycenaean.
a number of possible deciperments incld: yr=month, yr=4yrs, 9000/8000 = 900/800, 9/8 thousand yrs (milleniums) = 9/8 ages, div by schomos, precessional, etc.

Evidences of sudden continental shift(s)/sprint(s) not (just) drifting:
- http://headnheart.blogspot.com/2007/04/continental-shifts.html

Scenarios:
- shift was either: (1/a) both amers and old wor shifted (outward/away from ridge), or (2/b) only amer shifted west from ridge/old wor, or (3/c) only old wor shifted east (atlantis shift relative). Most likely 1/a because other wise w or e sea floor would be younger/older, and 'cause ridge equally develop on both sides?
- it would seem more likely that south amer was closer rather than north amer (cent amer/panama, etc), but I tend to think it was more likely that it was north that was closer not south (opposite agadir/gades, same latitude as gades/sais, kirchirs map, south to far down (even if nth pole in n amer), 2 parallel rockies/coast/cascades, distance would not be quite so far, etc.)
- atlantis was any/all of (nth, cent &/or sth ) america/s &/or armorica plate (american &/or european). More likely atlantis/shift was both americas because otherwise nth/sth atlantic would be older/younger.
(- I envision/idea that the atlantic was previously about/roughly half the present width/distance/duration.)
- The ridge, banks, bars, sargasso, bermuda triangle, &/or hotspot may be ghostly visible remnant of where the continental edge previously was (cf muddy sea), (&/or [wound] of shift?)
- the royal island city could therefore possibly even be divided like jigsaw betw or in any of amer (eg bimini), mid Atl ridge (eg azores) &/or armorica (eg heligoland).

Please note I am not saying that "Atlantis was Pangaea/World", but rather Atlantis shifted and was (any/all of n, s &/or c) America(s) &/or Armorica plate.

Atlantis/(daughter of) Atlas can't be identified with similar place names like Ad, Aztlan (Aztec), Atl, Atli, etc:
- As pointed out in the account, Atlantis is only the Greek translation of an Egyptian name which was translation of Atlantean name.
- A-tl (A-tonatiuh) "water" is Akkadian E-a.

Atlantis was (at least half) real not (just) myth/theory/lie/unscientific/metaphys:
- Plato said was Atlantis was true history, Plato was the one who elsewhere 1st used mythology in sense of fictional and legend as true.
- Every year there are more discoveries that the Atlantis account, Bible, oral memories, ancient historians/poets, myths are as historically/scientifically correct (as humanly possible) as modern sources.

the whole/surrounding/opposite continent of Atl acct = (Sth Amer-)Antarctica(-Australia), not Flem-Ath's nrthern-maj/uni-of-conts;
Antarctica was not Atlantis but (could've been part of) 'opp cont':
- The account says opp cont surrnded the world ocean both atlantis and old world.
- on the equidistant concentric projection of world map with N Pole as center has Antartica distributed around circumference.
- antarctica along whole of bottom our normal mercator projection.
- ptolemy's map has "africa" joint to [antarctica/australia] at bottom enclosing Indian ocean,
- oronteus finneus map has larger size antarctica.
- there were 3 (not Flem-Ath's 2) separate steps/land-masses mentioned in the Atl account:
opp cont (3) - ocean - atlantis (2) - outer ocean - inner sea/"eur & as/as & lib/lib & eur" (1).
- opposite continent/under-world to old world centre projection/view would be either west or south hemisphere [sw quadrant] (but only in global view :- if it was only nth/east hemisphere (or ne quadrant) worldview then underworld//opposite would be either nw, se, (arctic, antarctic, equator, greenwich or IDL).)
- "PARTS of opp cont." poss indicate partly ice-free like Antarctica was .
- (antarctica and australia shown as one continent in continental drift maps?)
- equidistant projection maps with Giza as centre have americas, antractica, austral around old world.
- ancient/mediaeval/early modern world maps often confuse sth amer/antarctica/australia (like old world and new world somewhat similarily superimposed in Enterline's book).
- north pole previously Hudson bay or thereabouts*, and sth pole prev in sea, = opposite to present (nth sea, sth land)/Flem-Ath. [* High arctic high culture/civilisation of macKenzie river (Rene Nordbergen/Stephen Bernad Cox).]
- names Opp cont, Under-world (absu), other-world, nether-world, Ant-arctica, Anti-podes, A-meru/Su-meru, A-tala/Su-tala, sub-terrannean, anti-chthoni, lower-world, (hyper-notian), ant-illes/ant-illa, (new world).

Oreichalc was brass, not amber, "not bronze":
- orichalc was a "metal" that was "mined" &/or "smelted". (amber was "fished"/"tears").
- orichalc was a combination of "pseudarguros" and chalcos (copper). "there is a stone which when burned becomes iron & then when heated in a furnace with a certain earth distils pseudarguros". pseudarguros (mock silver) matches zinc, a certain earth matches smithonite (zinc ore).
- amber was called "electron".
- compare Celt metal findrine "between bronze & silver". cp Persian ages of "steel", & an "iron compound" after gold & silver ages. cp biblical "clay & iron". compare ormolu "gold-like alloy of copper, zinc & tin"? (Cf Chinese Chang San-feng "alchemist residing in the mtns" [orei-chalc "mtn + copper"].)
- atlantis was possibly "brass/bronze/copper" age?

Acknowledgements:
- J Spanuth (Atlantis of the Nth), G Hancock (Sign & Seal), HS Bellamy ([Atlantis Myth]), S de C(h)amp/R Ley, (Tantalis book), I Donnelly (Atlantis Antediluvian World), E Sykes, E Zangger (Flood from Heaven), C Berlitz, Mavor, D Fasold (Discov of Noa's Ark), Chadderton (Time Detectives), C Cook (Pears Cyclop), Scott-Elliot, Flem-Ath/Nexus, A Alford;
- S Deyo, Prof A Santos, E Cayce, KR Bolton (Germanic Atlantis), AA Incendium (Tears of the Lady), J Kircher, atlantisrising, Star Gate, Plato (Timaeus; Critias).

Cognate gods names (tentative/provisional/pioneer)

2007-06-09T06:50:00.000+01:00

Eriu 'warrior' Irish [or Eros];
Arawn 'hunt, red, pigs' Welsh [or Orion/Arjuna?];
Ear 'war' German;
Jarl 'strong, weapons, hunts, rides, fights, fearless' Viking;
Lars Porsen(n)a 'war, conflict' Italian, Etruscan;
ARES 'war, warrior' Greek, Thracian;
Heros 'horseman' Thracia [?];
Giraitis 'hunting' Baltic;
Yarovit 'war, shield' Slav;
Jarri 'war, bow, battle' Hittite, Hurrian;
Ara(y) 'war' Armenian;
Arash (e) Kamangir 'the Bowman' Iranian;
Jaras 'killed ... arrow fired ... hunter' Indian;
y/j-r-(y/j)-(sh).

Llyr/Lir 'sea' Celt;
Nerthus 'fertility, island, washed, lake, drowned' Teutonic/German;
NJORD 'sea, storms' Nordic/Viking;
Lara 'river, naiad' Italia [or Fortuna?];
Illyr(i)us 'sea, river' Illyrian;
NEREUS 'sea' Greece;
Juras Mate 'sea' Balt;
Jurata 'sea, mermaid, storms' Slav;
Sangarios 'river' Phrygia;
Inara - Hittite, Hurrian [?];
Nor Mard '[Noah]' Armenia;
Nar Tsovinar 'water, sea, rain' Armenia;
Nara(yana) 'water, green, blue' India;
nj-r-.

Nechtan 'water' Celt;
Nodens/Nodons 'river, estuary' Celt;
Ritona 'river fords' Romano-Celt;
Hludana/Hlodyn/Hlothyn 'fertility, Rhineland, giantess' Nordic/Eddaic [or Hroptir?];
NEPTUNE/Neptunus 'sea, watering, irrigation' Italia;
Latona 'fountain, quench thirst, frogs' Italia;
Redon/Rodon 'oceans' Illyria;
Leto 'mother, impregnated' Greek;
Nonadey - Balt [or Nuada/Lyada?];
Lad(un)o 'fertility, peace, life' Slav;
Zaden 'fishermen' Armenia;
Anahita/Anaitis 'river, fertility' Armenia, Iran;
Rapithwin 'water' Iran [or Ra];
Apam Napat 'water' India, Iran;
n/l/r-(p/ch)-th/d-(w/y)-(n)-(s).

Fea 'war' Celt;
Poeninus 'mntain, alpine, Jupiter' Romano-Celt;
Hoenir 'fleet of foot, senses' Nordic, German;
Favonius 'wind' Italia;
Pannonius/Paeon 'paeon' Illyrian;
PAEAN/Paiawon 'war' Greek;
Papas/Papaeus 'Zeus' Phrygia, Scyth [?];
Hayk/Haik 'sky, strong, slew, Hercules' Armenia
Apaosha 'drought, ' Iran [?];
Pavana 'winds' India;
p-(v)-(n)-.

Damona 'cow' Celt;
Sinmara 'earth-pale, matter' Norse [or Trym, Vegtam?];
Semo Sancus/Semoni 'seed' Italia;
Shkumbe 'beaches' Illyrian [?];
SEMELE 'earth, mother' Greek;
Zemepatis 'chthonic, farmers, cattle' Balt;
Zemyna 'chthonic, vegetation' Balt;
Mati Syra Zemlya 'earth, mother' Slav;
Zemelo 'great mother' Phrygia;
Semiramis 'gardens' Armenia;
Zam 'earth' Iran;
Zami-Mata 'earth, fertiliy' India;
z-m-(n/l).

Dewi 'sea, deity' Welsh
Viviane 'Lady of the Lake' Celt/Arthurian;
Divona 'water, divine' Celt;
Dag 'night, day' Nordic;
DIANA 'moon, huntress' Italia;
Deving Usching ... Balt [?];
Deving Cerklicing 'black ox, woods' Balt [?];
Dziewona/Devana 'moon, huntress' Slav;
siune 'light' Hittite [?];
Nar Tsovinar 'heavens, fire, sea, water' Armenia;
Dsovinar 'born from sea' Armenia;
Dena 'daughter of light' Iran;
dz/ds/ts-w-n(g)-(r).

Aine 'sky' Irish [or ?];
Gwynn 'phantom hunt' Welsh [or Gwion?];
Oinn 'Odin' Eddaic [or Vegtam, Wayland, Ve?]
Veiovis 'goat, Apollo, Jove' Italia;
AEOLUS 'storms, winds' Italia;
Ou 'heavens, sky, I" Illyria;
Aeolos 'storms, winds' Greek;
Veja mate 'winds' Balt;
Oynyena Maria 'thunder, fiery, counsellor' Slav [?];
A'as 'wisdom' Hittite/Hurrian [or Ea?];
Ays 'wind, mad' Armenia;
Vata 'wind' Iran [or Az?];
Vayu 'winds' India;
w-y-(v)-.

Freyja 'fertility, vegetation' Nordic;
FREYR 'fertility' Nordic [or Fjorgyn?]
Flora 'flowers, sexual, spring' Italia;
PRIAPUS 'shade, rural' Italy;
Prende 'love' Albania;
Broket 'food, fortune' Illyria;
Priapos 'fertility' Greek, Phrygia [or Aphrodite?];
Porevit/Prove 'fertility, prolific, woods, power' Slav [or Perun?];
Spor '[growth]' Slav [?];
Peruwa 'horse' Hittite;
Prajapati 'sexual organ' India;
p-r-(y/w/g) [&/or p-y-r- ?]

Smertrios 'war' Gallic;
Mordur - Nordic [?];
MARS 'war, weather' Italic;
Marsyas 'satyr, flute, blood' Classical, Phrygia;
Martins - Baltic;
Marco 'hero, horse, sword' Slav;
Oynyena Maria 'thunder, fiery' Slav;
Maruta 'storm, [war]' India;
m-r-.

Lost Lands - part 1: Punt

2007-06-06T15:39:00.000+01:00

Punt:
Punon/Pinon (Edom, Num 33:42), Punjab, Phoenicia (came from the Erythrean sea), Punic, Pondo (sth Africa), Pontus, king Punda(rika) ("lotus"), Pontifex, Pon(a)pe/Pohnpe (Nan Matal/Nan Modal, [Pompeii/Pompey?]), Pul ("African", Isa 66:19), P(h)ut (Hittite -nt- ?), river Po, Spain/Hispania, ha saponi.

Consider/context:
- artefacts:
statue erected in Punt; terraces/terraced mountain.
- fauna/animals:
ivory, donkey/ass, fish, monkeys/apes/[baboons], panther/[leopard].
- ethnology/race/hair:
wavy-straight hair, steatopygus/large/enormously fat [cross between Andamese & Yap/Caroline], dark skinned, White/nth Semitic/Caucasoid.
- plants/flora/trees/vegetation:
myrrh, (frank)incense, balsam, pine incense, spices, coconut palms.
- geography/distance/direction/duration:
Asia, Red Sea/Suez/Indian Ocean, east, sunrise, Nile harbour of Thebes (return), seagoing ships, original home of the gods/[Egyptians].
- names/language:
Punt/Puanit/Pwenet, queen Eti/Ari, chief/prince/[king] Perehu/Paruah/Parihu, To-neter/Neter-to (divine/god's/holy land),
- gods:
Hathor, Bes.
- time:
18th dyn, 11th dyn, 6th dyn.

3 most most likely candidates not ruled out of listed names is Ponpe, Punjab/punda?, Phoenicia-Punon?

Either more than 1 Punt, or Punt a continent, or products not indigenous/native to Punt but from trade, or also includes expedition to Khenthenofer in Africa (circumnavigated; khoisan/pygmy).

Bes (Bek? or) name might be Bar? nature like Tiki.

Ponpe (&/or Indo-/Poly-/Mela-nesia) has in common with Punt:
- terraces (Kolosimo), coconuts (Paxton), race (cross Andaman-Yap, Huxley), 2 races (Malay & White "Oceanic" race, Kolosimo), name Punt/Ponpe, name Metaranimu/Metalanim/Nan Madol ~ Neter-to?, east/Asia, Bes/Tiki, jade/greenstone ("green gold"?), archaeological (Punt) civilisation artefacts.

Picture is they (started from qoseir to) went to Ponpe then, having ship full of products, decided to return to Nile port of Thebes rather than have to transport over land from qoseir, so circumnavigated Africa/Khenthennefer confounding extra expedititon together (unless canal of sesostris around then)?

"Punt" can't be (only) Africa/elsewhere (and not [also] elsewhere/Africa), but
"Punt" must (both) be elsewhere/Africa and also Africa/elsewhere because/since:
(1) some goods/descriptions almost def could not have been found in Africa (not "everything they procured could be found in Africa");
(2) there seems to be a couple of (now) "only-African" things (and return to Nile port indicates they must have circumnavigated africa anyway unless canal around then);
(3) the goods are not specificly/clearly (undeniably/indisputably/undoubtedly) stated to have come from (in) "Punt" (& not Khenthennefer/Africa)?

(horn of/tropical) Africa:
- doesnot have/unknown:
name (except sth Pondo), wavy-straight hair (not curly/woolly), race (only like cross betw andamese & yap, not negroid), east/sunrise/asia (except perhaps Horn of), archaeological (Punt) civilisation artefacts,
- (only) has/is:
khenthennefer, from qoseir to nile port, ivory, palms, coconuts(?), baboon/monkey/ape, leopard, giraffe, steatopygus, copper/gold.

My sources say it is not really known how long Hatshepsut's expedition took but some connect with 3 yr Solomon/Hiram voyage to Ophir//Tarshish. (Nechos 3 yrs was with # time duration stops.) Source says expedition was concluded just before the 9th yr of Hatshepsut. (Someone on a net/web forum said they think they may have read somewhere (ie dubious/unverified) that the expedition was 2 yrs?)

Childress says Ponape fire pit ashes have been carbon dated to only 900 yrs old (1000 ad) "... (and) suggested that the basalt rocks used to build the city came from ...."
However that dating is only based on one ash sample.
(I not overly respecting of orthodox dating which have been shown to be wrong/unlikely in many cases, tho usually the dates usually too old.)
Ponape/Pohnpei is freq called "ancient" (and megalithic/legend/underwater.)
Furthermoreover, Childress in his book also says (a little after the above) that theroluminescence dated Ponape pottery shards are at least 2000 yrs old "this pushes back the date by more than 1000 yrs".

Punt as Ponpe contributes to solving a number mysteries at same time incld those of: polynesian origins/history, ponpe mystery, racial origins (negritos), punt mystery.

Acknolws:
Charles Berlitz (Mysteries fr forgoten worlds), David Hatcher Childress (lost cities of anc Lemuria & the pacific),
Bey (Egypt und the Pharaohs), Clayton (chronicle of the pharaohs), Velikovsky (Ages in Chaos), "Sharrukin".

Prophetic Significance of the Dead Sea Scrolls

2007-06-04T06:56:00.000+01:00

-> The name Essenes may be the same as/from the Assideans in Maccabees (modern namesake Hasidim), or may be comes from (shoot/son of) Jessie (or similar Isaiah/Isa (Moslem transliteration of Jesus)), or from Essen/Choshen of High Priest's garment/chest.
-> Essenes maybe (incld in) the scribes/priests/rabbis/Levites/jews/lawyers/elders/israelites of the Gospels.
-> It seems there may be connection(s) between Qumran & the Ethiopians: both no book of Esther (cp Misler, Luther), both treasure/eunuch/baptism/Isaiah (Philip & Ethiopian in Acts).
-> The earthquake which damaged building at Qumran may be the one at/after JC's crucifiction, or one in Acts? (tho Qumran date supp earlier.)
-> The hidden treasure of the Copper Scroll(s) may be connected with the ark &/or Solomon's temple furnature (cp Temple Scroll), [or may be scrolls/scriptures?] (Cp "store up treasure in heaven".)
-> It is debated whether the Qumran building and Qumran caves/scrolls were connected or not, and/or whether the scrolls and Essenes connected or not, (&/or building & Essenes conn or not?). Hence they called Essene-LIKE sect. Distinction between Qumran DSS and Nag Hammadi DSS.
-> 11 DSS caves have been found, is there still one more to be found (12 tribes/patriarchs/apostles/disciples)? cp 11 apostles (minus Judas), (cp lost tribe Dan revelation.) Grant Jeffrey mentions "recently detected caves" & "new dig".
-> there might be a possibility of a connection of the Yahad 'uni' sect/grp of/in the qumran Dead Sea Scrolls with the YeHuD/yhw coin(s) of persian-greek times, and/or with Jihad 'holy war', but I guess the difference of semi-vowels (ayin or aleph) may make it unlikely?

-> (4000) "celibate/ascetic/monastic/communistic/..." Qumran sect recalls (144000) virgins of Revel (tho some of them did/were married and as evidenced by that they had (a) yr/s trial marriage period custom/tradition/rule.) (Virgin may be figurative? Trial marriage maybe trial membership?)

-> (3) Teacher(s) (rabbi?) of Righteousness matches (2) messiahs &/or 2 comings &/or 2 witnesses &/or forerunner &/or elijah.
-> T of R lead sect out from Jerusalem (flee) to wilderness refuge recalls woman/144,000 flee to wilderness (Petra?) in Revelation (cp Waco).
-> T of R preceeds messiah like Elijah (Malachi) &/or John &/or 2 witnesses preceed Jesus Christ, &/or 1st coming before 2nd coming. (Jesus said John was "Elijah", John said he was not Elijah.)
-> T of R called the prophet, the Prophet spoken of by Moses who John denied being (and Mohammed claimed to be) but who was Jesus Christ.
-> T of R called the interpreter of the law (mosaic), matches Jews saying messiah will interpret even spaces between letters, and JC saying not one jot or tiddle will pass away without being fulfilled.
-> T of R & (Jesus) Christ in common: Melchizedek, martyred, persecuted, teacher/rabbi, baptism, messiah?, ['priests'], etc.
-> James Just & Paul Apostle (as opp to Saul Tarsus), &/or Jesus Christ & John Baptist were not dualistic "enemies". (Written earlier) New Testament (Roman) Jesus Christ more reliable than ("orally earlier"?) Talmud (Maccabean) Ye(i)shu(a) ha-Notzri (disputed by some whether even same or not).

-> the son of God scroll says "He shall be called the son of God, & they shall designate him son of the Most High. Like the appearance of comets, so shall be their kingdom. For brief yrs they shall reign over the earth & shall trample on all; 1 people shall trample on another & 1 province on another until the people of God shall rise & all shall rest from the sword." The "son of God" here is the Antichrist not (Jesus) Christ (as Jeffries/Jeffreys would have it), the time length is more like Tribulation (than the Millenium or AD).

-> Melkiresha &/or (3) Wicked Priest(s) &/or Man (ish?) of the Lie match the Dragon &/or Antichrist/Beast &/or False Prophet (&/or Harlot) of Revelation. (Disputed whether W Pr & Liar are same person, or Liar agent of W Pr.)
-> wicked (resha?) priest/melki-resha maybe related to prophetic prince Rosh? Wicked (resha?) priest/Melki-resha maybe chief (rosh?) priest/high king?
-> Wicked Priest committs abonimations recalls abomination of desolation(s) of Daniel.
-> the spouter of lies recalls the little horn with mouth speaking grt things of Daniel, the false prophet, &/or the Lie they shall believe of Paul's letter/Revelation (= "you shall not die but become like God(s)"?)
-> the Liar is not = Jesus Christ "because of his birth/[resurrection/ascension]".
-> Jesus Christ not wicked, nor of (high) priestly descent tho he was priest of Melchizedek.

.................|....TofR.....|....MotL...........|....W(H)P
Wermis........|...Jesus C...|.....[Simon M]....|...S Maccabea
[Thierring]....|...John B....|....Jesus C.........|....J Christ
[Eisenman]...|...James J...|....Paul A..........|...Annas

Religion & Politics of the 3rd Millenium (part 1)

2007-05-27T01:37:00.000+01:00

We are all creations or emanations/manifestations/generations/evolutions of The One God or Goddess.

All religions/mythologies/philosophies/etc ultimately came (d/evolved) from one common original .

Man is/has become fallen/dualist/separated (death, de-/dys-/sickness/illness, suffering/persecution).
Eg: "(man origin from nature [holistic],) man has been shielded from nature by civilisation and become inverse-/un-/anti-natural [out/dualist], and (given rise to some) degenerate(s) [out/dualist] thru dysgenics/mixing."

(Good and) evil/dualism came out of original good/holism.

Man search/"quest"/strives (earn/works) to become whole [re-]/gods.

"Mythology" like (not just) the bible is about (approach as) a dualistic/dialectic interaction
(holism/in/truth/survival vs dualism/out) throut the whole of Time (human/world/cyclical (hi)story (& prophecy)).

that is there are 2 lines/sides within/between every religion/mythology.

Each/every tribe/religion/nation/people/culture/etc (incld modern books like Messianic legacy) has its/their own traditional (or synthetic/composite), dualistic definition/classification of In/Holist and Out/Dualist, generally (naturally, relatively) seeing/viewing/representing themselves as In, and (lump) all others (non-) as Out/inverse/common enemy (gentiles/goyim, pakeha, barbarian, infidel, kafirs, set/hyksos, ). .

In - citizens;
in/out - subjects/guests/allies/proselytes;
out/in - foreign nationals;
Out - foreigners/enemies.

Taking any 2 or more religions, sometimes the 2 lines/sides may be/are common/allies/match/equate same way around, &/or sometimes may be different/opposed/inversed (eg Asuras and Devas switched between Indian & Iranian), and/or sometimes mixed (eg BIs, Baigent/Lincoln/Leigh).

Ultimately there are only 2 "dualistic" sides/ways (1 whole), or, all religions reduce (ally/polarise) to 2 sides (1 whole).

judaeo-xtian is unique to [all/most] other world/pagan religions.

both sides/most seem to agree that judaeo-xtian and ["anti-dualists"] are on different opposite sides.

What is also evident is that the pagan 2 lines are inverse to the biblical/Judaeo-Xtian 2 lines; the antichrist/christ of judaeo-xtian is [christ] (Horus)/[antichrist] (Set) of pagan.

seth...horus
|.....\/...|
|...../\...|
abel...cain

which matches the non-/anti-Xtian view that "Xtianity is dualism". This is also illustrated by various writers inversing the 2 lines in the bible like favouring 6th day man/elohim over 8th day man/yhwh.

it is a common/popular arguement that "dualist" judaeo-xtianity came from "dualist" zoroastrianism (&/or atenism &/or "neurotic" rome [&/or Set]) (or both come from common origins).

However, there is a difference (distinct) between Xtianity/dualism and occult/anti-dualism/naturalism/paganism/"satanism" over what ulitmate One Whole, In/good (and Out/"dark/evil/sin"/dualist) is true (origins) as to who is artificial/moralistic/unholistic/unnatural/dualistic/evil/harmful.

it depends which side one is on, or which side is true.

So to xtians/if judaeo-xtianity is true, then (God is Holistic/In, and) [pagan/occultist/antidualist] are out/dualistic/mixed/devil/sinners/fallen.

to antidualists, "dualistic" zoroastrianism & "dualistic" xtianity are both (common) out/moralistic/dualist/Set, like nationalists say capitalism & communism are really on same side/2 sides same coin even tho they are dualistic enemies of each other.

acknowls:
adolf hilter (mein kampf), gerald massey (bk of beginnings), a j gregor (nature of prejudice), k r bolton, petros koutoupis (origins of the nephilim), j/d jewell, e h j steed (2 be 1), tani jantsang/phil marsh, e sykes, dan brown (da vinci code), baigent/lincoln/leigh (messianic legacy), brooks/moody (spirit of truth spirit of error), a h sayce, bible, francis parker yockey/ulick varange (imperium), rob zacharias, hegel, carl jung, f neitzsche,

dualisms &/or (antidual) dialectics (both/neither):

Judaeo-Xtian/Gnostic:
Adam - Enosh (Hislop);
Tree Life - Tree Knowledge (Steed);
Seth - Cain;
sons of God - daughters of men;
Eden - Nod;
God/YHWH - Devil/Satan;
Shem - Japheth (J Jewell);
Yhwh - El;
Israel/Jacob - Esau/Edom;
Moab - Ammon;
Ephraim - Manasseh (BIWF);
Moses - Aaron (Amp);
Moses - Elijah (Misler);
Abram - Lot;
Isaac - Ishmael (Amp, Paul);
Judah/jews - Israel;
Adam - Serpent (Jantsang);
cupbearer - baker (Misler);
Lucifer - Satan;
sons of light - sons of darkness;
ears - eyes;
Jubal - Jabal;
Adah - Zillah;
Cain - Tubalcain;
Christ - Jesus (Brooks/Moody);
Abel - Cain;
3 - 1;
Jn - synoptic (WG Simpson);
NT - OT;
Setian - Ophite (Jantsang);
Arminian - Calvinist (Misler);
Fundamentalist - Modernist (ME Ravage);
(seed) woman - (seed) serpent (KR Bolton/F Scorpio);
evil spirit - demon (Misler);
Gibborim - Nephilim;
Jerusalem - Babylon (Misler);
False Prophet - Anti-Christ;
Peleg - Joktan;
good - evil/bad;
Magog - Gog;
Pharisees - Saducees/scribes (Misler);
Saturday - Sunday;
rock - sand (I Lewis);
Zion - Sion ;
David - Solomon (Misler);
Mordechai - Haman (Misler);
[wheat] - tares (Bolton/Scorpio);
sheep - goats;
Joshua - Caleb;
right - left;
Mary - Martha (Amp);
cross - rose;
[lamb - dragon];
(white - black;)
wonderful - fearful;
[David - Saul];
Eve - animals;
lt to rt - rt to lt (Misler, Waddell);
(scorpio/serp - aquilo (I Myers);)
Israel - Jacob ([Misler/Focus]);
Rachel - Leah;
Gad - Asher (Hislop);
Behemoth - Leviathan;
Paul - Peter;
Adam (rule/chauvinism) - Eve (desire/feminism);
8th day - 6th day man (Jewell, Jantsang/[Peters]);
Paul A - James J ([Eisenman?]);
Jesus C - John B (Theirring/Jantsang);
Jesus - Lucifer (JT Chick/Mormon);

Phoenician/Syrian/Canaanite/Semitic:
Khoser - Hasis (Sykes, Pratney);
driver - expeller (Sykes);
Elim - Elohim (M Jordan);
Baal - Yamm ;
Sachar - Salem (B Walker, );
Hyposouranios - Ousoos (Sykes);
Aleion - Mot (Sykes);
Mot - Leviathan (Sykes);
Baal - El (Sykes);
Baal - Mot (A Millard, );

Arab/Moslem:
Shia - Sunni;

Mesopotamian:
Kish - Uruk (NK Sandars);
[Umma - Lagas];
Apsu - Tiamat (Heidel);
An - Ki (Black & Green, Sandars);
Igigi - Anunaki (Jordan, Sykes);
Enki/Ea/flood saviour - Enlil/flood sender (Alford, );
Sumer/accad - Akkad/sem/chald (Sayce);
Euphrates - Tigris;
Sarku/lt - Admu/dk (G Massey);
Anu - Ea (L Stringer);
anshar - kishar;
lahmu - lahamu;
shaven - bearded (JR Baker);
Gilgamesh/Izdubar - Enkidu/Eabani;
Mediterranean - Persain Gulf;
sexagesimal - decimal (Alford);
fire - stones (Sayce);
Bel - Dragon (Apocrypha);

Iranian:
Persia - Media (Herodotus, Daniel);
[Vohu Manah - Akah Manah];
Tishtriya - Apaosha (Robinson & Wilson);
Arya - Turia (Donnelly, );
Ahura/Amesha Spentas - Devas (Sykes, );
Ahura Mazda/Ohrmuzd - Angra Mainyu/Ahriman;
[Ashavan - Drugvan];

Indian:
India - Pakistan;
Pandavas - Kauravas (Cotterell);
Vasishtha - Viswamitra (Cotterell);
Deva - Asura (Daneilou, Cologne, Sykes);
[Arya/Nord - Dasyu/Dravidian];
Yonijas - Lingajas (B Walker);
Brahman - Atman;
Yama - Yami;
Shiva - Shakti (J Campbell);
Siva/Hara - Visnu/Hari ;
Krishna - Balarama ;
(Yab - Yum ;)
Surya/sun - Chandra/moon (Dowson, Jantsang);
(Hinayana/Ther... - Mahayana;)
[Brahman - Kshatriya];
Kama - Mara (A Cotterell);
Mitra - Varuna (Jordan);

Tibet:
Yab - Yum (Steed);
Khen-Pa - Khen-Ma (Jordan);

China:
Yin - Yang;
Fu Hsi - Nu Kwa;
Shen - Kwei (Sykes/Mind Alive);

Japan:
Izanagi - Izanami;
In - Yo (Sykes);
Chrysanthemum - Dragon (Mishima);

Egyptian:
crook - flail;
Set - Apophis;
Lower Egypt - Upper Egypt (Alford, );
Dua - Sef (Sykes);
Geb - Nut;
Shu - Tefnut (Alford);
Horus (race) - Set (race);
Horus the Elder - Horus the Younger;
Wadjet - Nekhbet (Clayton, );
sedge - bee (Clayton, );
papyrus - lotus (Clayton, );
Danaus - Aegyptus;
black land - red land (Clayton, );
Uraeus - Apophis (Hislop);
Hathor - Sekhmet (Sykes, );
Isis - Nephthys (Sykes, );
Ra/Re - Atum/Amon (Massey, );
Nun - Naunet (Jordan, );
Mantchet - Semketet;
Manu - Bahu;
nthern heavens - sthern heavens (Massey);
Osiris - Set;

Benin/Voodoo/Yoruba:
Mawu - Lisa;
Obatala - Odudua (Sykes);

Amerind:
white Manitou - black Manitou (B Walker, );

Mexican:
centrifugal - centripetal (Ceram);
Xiu - Itza (Ceram, );
quetzal/feather - coatl/serpent;
ugly/cruel - beautiful/aesthetic (W Pratney);
N Amer/Mexico - S Amer/Peru (Fitzgerald-Lee);

Peru:
sons of light - giants deprived of light (D Cologne);

Armenian:
Ara the Fair/[Hayk] - Bel (Assyrian);

Slavic:
Bielobog - Chernobog (Sykes);
Younger Bogatyr - Elder Bogatyr (J Jewell);

Greek:
Mykenae - Troy (radio);
Achilles - Hector ;
Epicurean - Stoic ;
Zeus - Theran (unverified);
Zeus - Typhon;
Athens - Sparta ;
[Athens - Atlantis];
hot - cold spring (Plato);
Prometheus - Epimetheus;
Hermes - Aphrodite;
Cupid - Psyche;
Uranus - Gaia (Sykes);
Apollo - Artemis;
Zeus - Prometheus;
[Hercules - Gigantes (RL Green)];
Otus - Ephialtes ;
mt Ossa - mt Pelion ;
Plato/Pythagoras - Aristotle (Bram/F&W, );
Dionysian - Apollonian (Jung);

Italic:
Romulus - Remus;
Mars - Venus (Jordan, );
Castor - Pollux;
Janicula - Saturnia (Hislop);
Patricians - Plebs;
Sol/Helios/Apollo - Sol Niger (B Walker);

Germanic/Nordic/Western/Eddaic:
Aryan - Jew (Hitler);
George - Dragon;
Gods - Dark (A Incendium);
Vili - Ve (Sykes);
Ask - Embla;
Heimdall - Loki ;
Lif - Lifthrasir;
Thor - Midgradsorm/Jormungard;
Baldr - Hoder/Loki ;
Thor - Etins ;
Aesir - Vanir (Larouse/Dumezil, Cologne);
Frey - Freya (Jordan);
Rob Hood - K Arthur (H Gilbert);
Saxon - Norman;
Welfs - Ghibbelines;
Lancaster - York;
lion - unicorn;

Celtic:
Lleu - Dylan (B Walker);
Gog - Magog;
Catholic/Ireland - Protestant/England;
(George - Dragon;)
Unicorn - Lion;
Lug - Balor;
TDD - Fomor (D Cologne);
Merlin/Lady of the Lake - Mab (TV);
[Arthur - Mordred];

(Garden of) Eden

2007-05-24T09:21:00.000+01:00

Genesis says that a river flowed out of Eden to water the Garden ("the river of life") and there it started to become divided into 4 rivers (the Euphrates, Hiddekel/Tigris, Gihon and Pishon.)

It seems to have been pretty much unanimously taken for granted that because 2 of the rivers of Eden (the Tigris and the Euphrates) are names of rivers in Iraq, that the biblical Garden of Eden is located either at the source or mouth of these 2 rivers [or perhaps where 2 rivers bends come close together in middle Iraq near Baghdad?] (&/or cp some say Babylon is on Eden site), while the [Gihon or Pison] is arbitrarily identified with an Arabian ex-river west of the Euphrates meeting towards south (cp S Deyo), and the [Pison or Gihon] is arbitrarily identified with an Elamite river east of Tigris meeting towards south.

(The Gihon has also alt been connected with the Ceyhan to west of Euphrates diverging from near it in north, or with the (Ethiopian) Nile, or else with the Euphrates which was also called by the name; and the Pishon has sometimes been identified with the [Indus/Ganges], or Seyhan, (compare [Urantia/Sarmast]).)

However, as pointed out in some of your previous posts there are some difficulties with this:

1 - It is possible that the Great Flood could have drastically altered the surface features of the Earth wiping out all traces of the rivers of Eden;

2 - The Tigris and Euphrates don't share a common source, &/or they didn't meet when the ancient gulf used to extend further north upto Ur, &/or in ice age the gulf was dry land;

3 - No definate proof of identification of the other (2) river(s) Pison (& Gihon);

(4 - Dilmun was in the north not Bahrein, &/or Bahrein ("Dilmun") is not at mouth or source of rivers.)

Moreover, somewhile ago I discovered a possible alternative theory of my own:
A picture of the 4 rivers of Eden in Philipot uses the symbol of a circle with a cross in it ("sun wheel", note the CROSS? (river/blood)), which implies that the rivers were global/world sized rivers dividing the whole earth, which disqualifies the Euphrates/Tigris/Nile/etc as a glance at an atlas will show they are small-local not crossing whole continents (though there are said to be traces of lots of rivers under the Sahara desert and/or Nile supposedly once flowed w-e, and also Rift valley).
But then a glance at maps of the stages of the continental "drift" do show global/continental sized "rivers" dividing Pangaea along/between the edges of the future continents, suggesting the possibility that the continents may have split up (&/or come together (Ural, Rift valley)) along the rivers of Eden, the rivers widening into oceans.
In ancient sources the borders of Europe, Asia and Libya/Africa were defined by rivers, (and in the Bible the borders of prophetic Israel are the Euphrates & Nile (or wadi Arish).)
The ancients considered the seas/oceans as parts of 1 RIVER Oceanus.

(Please note I am not saying that (the Garden of) Eden was Pangaea, only that the 4 rivers out of Eden crossed the whole of Pangaea.)

Furthermore I have also found the Genesis account of the 4 rivers of Paradise in a number of mythologies around the world, confirming the historicity of both.
The combination of the biblical and mythological gives a fuller picture, and seemingly strengthens my theory (esp some like the Aztec, Babylonian, Chinese):

-> Judaeo-Xtian version: 4 rivers of Eden/paradise divide whole earth (ref: Philipot). [Pseudepigrapha says 3 sons Noah divided 4 region post-flood earth leaving 1 qrter unallocated/unihab.]
-> Sumer-Akkad version: 4 rivers Karduniyash (T, E, Surappi, Ukni); 4 rivers Dilmun; "To water the 4 regions of the earth" (refs: A Heidel, .)
[-> Indian version: 4 rivers Meru?]
-> Chinese version: Kun-lun source of 4 great rivers which flowed in 4 directions (ref Larousse.)
-> Aegean version: 4 rivers Thera.
-> Norse version: 4 streams Ymir/Audhumla (refs: JC Cooper.)
-> Egyptian: Nile comes from core of earth. (Atlantic cross?)
-> Navaho: In the age of beginning 4 streams flowed from the earth's center to the 4 cardinal points.
-> Aztec version: Tonacatecuhtli drove 4 roads thru centre of earth after cataclysm to disperse flood waters of the deluge (ref: M Jordan.)
-> Peru: Cuzco 4 parts/divs.

Alternatively the rivers could (now) be underground rivers of water which scientists have discovered (& known to ancient dowsers) underneath the [continents &/or oceans].*

Alt/also there is a tradition which locates the Garden of Eden on the site of Jerusalem [or Mt Tabor?] which is considered to be the geopolitical centre of the world in Judaeo-Christian tradition.*
Eden could then be Jerusalem, and pre-flood Enoch/Nod to the (then) east of Eden could correspond to post-flood Babel (Babylon/Borsippa) (as in the Roman tradition of 2 cities on the same site "1 on each side of the flood", compare cities on two sides of a river? cp Ad/Urem) rather than Babylon being Eden as some have claimed (cp hanging gardens, Eridu/Edin.)

* This could perhaps be connected with the 2 rivers of living water that will come forth from [mt Olivet] (cp Bethesda?) in prophecy.

The Phoenician myth of Sad-El ("field/mount of God") the residence of El at the source of the 2 rivers, although it resembles the rivers of Eden, is also/alt evidence of an identification of Eden with the landing place of the Ark (perhaps from Noah planting vine?) El can be identified with Noah, since El was an old man, father of mankind, and on one occasion was helplessly drunk, [and his wife Asheratian was mother of 70 like table of 70 nations in Gen 10]. Sad-El evidently corresponds to Sumerian Dilmun which was at source of the rivers where Utnapishtim/Ziusudra dwelt.
(Enoch east of Eden, Babylon east of Jerusalem, Babel east of Ararat?)

The flaming sword may represent fire/conflaguration?

The 4 rivers/[lands] may be types of 4 world ages, with Havilah land of gold = golden age? (2nd land Cush may matche Greek trad that Ethiopians were silver age?)

Havilah :- Himalaya,
Cush :- Kur,
Asshur :- Asia, Euros/Europa,
Nod :- India, Andes, Nuristan, Nuzi, Noatun,
Pishon :- Apsu,
Gihon :- Nihon, Ceyhan,
Hiddekel :- Itak, Tigris,
Euphrates :-

Eden:
edin, bit-adini/beth-eden (tel-barsip), kar-dunyash, ve-dan, jotun/etin, aden, athens, idun, jordan, [guedin, anedin], suedin, padan,
lugal-id/itak/etana,
ida, hades, ad,

Acknowledgements:
bruce paul, brian hooper, herodotus, pseudepigrapha, philipot, NWT, david rohl, peter helmkamp/seirizzim, stan deyo, graham hancock (sign & seal), a h sayce, david fasold, [urantia/sarmast], geoffrey parker, pambi ncube, radio, chuck misler (66 40), thubron (hills of adonis).

4 evangelists/gospels;
4 horsemen Apoc (Rev);
"4 lets Corinthians";
4 tetrarchs;
4 faces cherubs/liv creatures/Adonai (Rev, Ezek);
4 cities (tetrapolis) Nimrod ;
4 letters tetragrammation YHWH;
4 beasts/metals (Daniel);
4 heads/wings leopard (Dan);
4 rivers Eden (Gen);
4 dogs Nabiru/Marduk (Sayce, Sitchin);
4 Vedas;
4 yugas;
4 heads Brahma;
4 castes;

4 worlds Celt (up, mundane, low, Mide);
4 Celtic beasts (Naddair)?
4 cities Celtic (M, G, F, F, Sykes);
firkin 4th of a barrel;
4 suits pack (tarot) cards;
4 Jungian types;
4 arms swastika (Cox, Helmkamp, );
tetraktys (1+2+3+4);
4 elements;
4 yrs Olympiad/leap yr/election/Sothis;
4 heads/faces Sventovit/Porevit;

4 sons Horus (Canopic);
4 yrs Sothic/Sirius;
4 faces/sides/corners pyramid (base);

4 suns Aztec;
4 chacs;
4 bacabs;
4 tlaloque/tlalocs;

4 dimensions (Paul, Misler, );
[4 zodiac pts (L,T,A,S, Myers);]
4 seasons;
4 corners/cardinal pts/quadrants;
4 winds/directions;
4 feet quadruped;
4 weeks month;
4 wheels;
4 sides/corners square/quadrilateral/quadrangle;
4 seasonal/daily positions Ursa Maj/Plow;
4 lge moons Jupiter;
[4 states matter;]

Ur "of the Chaldees"

2007-05-19T22:16:00.000+01:00

Ever since Wooley's identification of the Biblical Ur of the Chaldees with Ur city in ancient sw Iraq the orthodox opinion has been and still is that the biblical Ur was Ur city.
But there have been quite a number of other scholars however who believe that Ur city was not Ur of the Chaldees, most of whom favour locating Ur of the Chaldees rather somewhere in the north of Iraq instead (Urfa being the most popular tho unlikely specificly nomiated site).
There are a number of arguements against the Ur city/southern view, and in favour of north:

-> Ur city too far from Haran. (They reply that ancients did make long distance travels.)

-> Big long round-about up-and-down route (incld up Balih to Haran) (desert less harsh in anc/prehist than now). (They reply that they did so probably to avoid possibly hostile places, &/or that desert was as harsh then, and/or that they only had to follow established routes.)

-> Ur was on (west side of) Euphrates river (and Haran was on east side, requiring 2nd unmentioned crossing) re Josh 14:2/Eber/Hebrew. (Though they reply that Wooley said Euphrates previously "washed the foot of the western rampart, [ie Ur on east] taking a new course to the east", and/or that "for anyone living in the Levant, Babylonian Ur would have lain conceptually beyond the river, whatever the precise geography.")

-> Descriptive ("of Chaldees") unnecessary for major/known cities. (They say necessary define/identify/clarify/explanation/designation "reflecting the renewed eminence of this Ur under the Neo-Babylonians or Chaldeans".)

-> Josephus quoting Nicolaus of Damascus says "Abram ... came ... out of the land above Babylon, called the land of the Chaldeans ....", above implies either Zagros or upper/north Mesopotamia (Tigris) (unless he was using Egyptian 'up' for south). (They reply that there was high land in Arabia on sw of Chaldea, &/or Ur was tel.)

-> Abra(ha)m said that he was from/land his fathers was Padan-Aram/Aram-Naharaim in Gen 24:4 combined with Gen 24:10 and 25:20 etc cp Gen 12:1, same words used in Gen 11:28; Abraham was "an Arimi ready to perish" Deuteronomy 26:5. (They reply that translation implies Harran was his & his father's adopted land, and/or was the land of his relatives not ancestors.)

-> Hebrews (like Maoris) not acquainted with cities/houses (except from Enoch/Babel/Egypt/Canaan/Ur?) (Though they reply that some studies claim they were, and/or that there were Semite nomads around Ur city, &/or Abram may have afterward become nomad/shepherd.)

-> The contention that it took Abraham great faith to go from a "good" (comfort/secure) urban city/civilisation to the "bad" rural country is not necessarily correct, it could take equal/more faith to leave 'good' (healthy/community/) country home (&/or to go to 'bad' city). (Semites were around not in Ur city.)

-> Hebrew Genesis says Ur [ha]-Kasdim not Ur "of the Chaldees" tho Greek Acts does say Chaldees. (They reply that Kasdim always corresps to/used elsewhere in bible for Chaldeans (from Chaldees~Aramaeans~Kesed) [tho Chaldees v-v not always called Kasdim], and no ha-). To comment that they different books/authors/times they reply whole bible is late/anachronism.

-> If Moses wrote genesis (as attest by JC himself) then Chaldees not at Ur in his (or Abram's) time (Moses came after Kesed). (They reply that Chaldees/whole bible is anachronism/late, &/or that moses was 18th or 19th dyn.)

-> Chaldean never specifically/directly attached/connected to Ur city in history. (They reply Ur was incld within/on boundary of land possessed by Chaldeans.)

-> No trace/tradition of Abram in Ur city records (the Jews who lived in Babylonia did not know the site). (They reply means nothing much, &/or that in Josephus Ur is obviously Ur city.)

-> In Septuagint, Gen 11:28-31 & Acts 7:2-4 Ur is (only) called a land/country (not a city) (tho in those verses it was not the Ur name itself which was necessarily called the "land/country"), no land of Ur in south except Ki-uru/Akkad. (They reply that Ur was kingdom/city-state/hinter-land/supreme.)

-> In Gen 11:28-31 where it says Terah took Abram, Lot & Sarah with him from Ur it doesn't say that Nahor went with them. Nahor's son is later located at Nahur city, and Nahor's grandson is later located at Harran.

-> 3rd dyn Ur may be too late for Abram who lived only (1)400 yrs after the flood & at the start of history just after longevity (cp Brahmins). (They reply that Ur was around in Early Dynastic Period/is 2nd earliest Ur name.)

-> Ur (city) is less correct rendering of Urim(a)/Uru/Urummu/Hur/Uri(w)a. (They reply Ur is correct.)

-> Acts 7:2 says Abram from [Roman province of] Mesopotamia (OT Aram-Naharaim/Padan-Aram) which was north not south Mesopotamia. (They reply Roman province established after Acts written, and Greek Mesopotamia included south.)

-> If Kasdim was an anachronism then why did text say Kasdim not Chaldees/Kaldu/Shinar/Babylonia to make more clearer. (They reply Kasdim always elsewhere Hebrew for Kaldu.)

-> Names of Patriarchs, Abram's/Terah's ancestors/relatives (Nahor, Haran, Ragau, Arphaxad, Shem, Eber, Serug, Terah, Kesed, Aram) all found in north/middle (Mari/Ebla) not around Ur city. (They say irrelevant, they say some late, they say some unrelated names/accidental, they say some anachronisms.)

-> Kasdim = Kesed son of Nahor in north/mid (or = Arphaxad). (They say they migrated, &/or geographical/transfered/analogy.)

-> Why did they stop at Haran but not any other equally impressive places like Mari? (They say not on route (hostile/harsh), &/or Ur and Haran common religion.)

-> Terah/Abram left/fled (Jud 5:6) Ur situation so why (follow known route &) settle in similar/related Haran situation (religon, allied, etc). (They say they stoped there because similar/related situation.)

-> Biblical Chaldeans were Aramaic/Syriac, (they say Chaldeans & Arameans of records [sometimes] different).

-> Ezekiel says land Chaldeans by Kebar river, (they say Kebar was [part of Euphrates at Babylon]).

-> Kabbala has Abram saying "as a child ... I spent much time jesting with the young men of the mtns of Urartu...."

-> Ockham's razor.

-> Abraham "the Hebrew/Aberite" (Gen 14:13) "from Aber a naher (Aber the river)" which some say
that can't be from Heber/Eber, Habiru, "the other side of the flood" [or perates ("cross/pass over", Sept)], could perhaps be cognate with river/province Khaburatum/Habur/Kebar/Hubur?

-> Jewish Talmud relates that Terah worshipped many/12 gods (Tribes, Zodiac, Teraphim?), there were not such number of gods worshiped at Ur city.

-> Josephus said "in ... Ur ... his (Haran's) monument is shown to this day", has it been found at Ur city or recorded there?

-> "Ram caught in thicket" at Ur city is otherwise called the "goat with the tree of life/(cross)".

North/early "Chaldea/Chaldee" names:
- Chaldeans/Chaldees/Chaldini/Khaldini/Chaldaei (sw Babylonia on Persian gulf bordering Arabia Desert & sthn district Gerrha/Kuwait, Strabo/C Ptolemy, moon/stars, 5 tribes).
- Celts/Galatians.
- (K)haldi (Urartian ram deity).
- Khaldi-Ziuquni (Urartian city).
- Khaljis/Ghilzais (Afghan tribe).
- Khalitu (to west of Urartians)/Xalitu (Urartians country, foreign/Urartian, cuneiform, Rusa 2, 676 BC).
- Khalita (province Assyrian/Mari).
- Kelti (wadi Amarna letters).
- Khaldaioi/Chaldios/xald?a/Chaldia/Chaldaei (Black sea/nth Assyria/Armenia/Carduchian/east Turkey, Greeks/Persian, Cyrus/Xenophon, Cyropaedia/Anabasis).
- Cordyaeans/Gordyene/Carduchian/Curid/Cordene /Kurd/Kardu(m)/Gordyeaen/Gordian/Gordea (mt(ns)).
- Khal (Tigris)/Khar (Syria-Palestine, Egyptian recs).
- Karthli (Georgian).

- Kesed/Kasdim (
- Kassites
- kshatriyas (warrior caste, Indian)
- Pikhat Khusetu sha Khashidia/uru nam khu-si-e-tum sha khash-di-ia (Babylonian texts, Nebuchadnezzar)
- Khosrau/Chosroes/Osrohene (
- Khazar
- Yezidi
- Kurd

Josh, Dave, Solomon, etc

2007-05-15T07:12:00.000+01:00

Seeming similarities between Amarna & united monarchy periods:
Tut's "ark", Hatshepsut's temple Deir el-Bahri, Aton/Adon, Akhenaten's hymn/psalm, "monotheism", Tut/David, Hatshepsut/[Bath-]Sheba, proverbs/Amenemopet (ca 19th dyn).

Similar names (between Amarna letters & united monarchy in bible) if not also contemporaneous/same natures/persons:
Abimilki - Abibalus;
Shalmaiati - Solomon;
Addudani/Addadani/Adadanu - Adonijah, [Araunah];
Vidia - David, [Uriah];
Biridia/Biridri - Benhadad;
Addaia - David, Jedidiah, Hadad/(Adados);
Dudu - Hadad, David????
Akizzi - Achish;
Aiab - Joab, Ahab;
Hiba/Hepa - Sheba, Ahab;
IapahAddi - Jephthah????;
Ebedtov - Toi/Tou, Tob, Zobah, Tabrimmon????;
Azaru/Aziru/Aziri - Hadadezer, Hazael;
Amelutgazmesh - Amalek, Agag, Gaza, Gath, Mesha, Moses;
Huriya - Uriah;

Habiru may not be Hebrews (cp Iberia?) but might be Cabiri of [Phoenician] (&/or compare (can't be) Habiri title of Hittite warriors)?

Some soucres say Ugarit was burned in reign of Akhenaten (Kolosimo). Other sources say Ugarit was burned in reign of Merneptah (Spanuth).
Now I know that there were quite a number of strata/layers &/or building phases over the time of Ugarit's existence, but I don't know if there were 2 burnt strata or only one? Need confirmation either way to rule out or not if Akhenaten and Merneptah connected?

The 3 (or "7" (Velikovsky)) yr famine of Amarna letters (18th dyn), &/or the famine/drought that came at end of Ugarit/Hittite just before foreign invaders [19th dyn/Sea Peoples or 18th dyn/Amarna] (J Lehman), may be the 3 yr famine of David (2 Sam 21:1; 24:13) [or famine of Ruth or Elijah/Elisha?]

(1.) old/orthodox chronology:
Abe - Ur 3/Larsa/Babylon 1/[Old Hittite];
Jose - Hyksos (15th/16th dyn);
Mose - 18th/19th dyn;
Josh - Amarna (18th dyn);
Shishak - Sheshonk (22nd dyn);
Necho - Neco (26th dyn);

(2.) Velikovsky's chronology:
Mose - Dudimose (13th dyn);
Judges - Hyksos (15th/16th dyn);
Saul - 15th/16th/18th dyns;
Solomon - Hatshepsut (18th dyn);
Shishak - Tuthmosis 3 (18th dyn);
Zerah - Amenhotep 2 (18th dyn);
divided monarchy - Amarna (18th dyn);
So - Sheshonk (22nd dyn);
Necho - Ramses 2 (19th dyn);

(3.) Rohl's/"new" chronology:
Jose - 12th dyn;
Mose - Sobekhotep (13th dyn);
Josh/Judges - 15th/16th dyn;
Saul - Amarna (18th dyn);
David - Amarna (18th dyn);
Shishak - Ramses 2 (19th dyn);

my tentative provisional possibilities:
Abe - 1st dyn;
Jacob - 2nd dyn;
Jose - 3rd/4th dyn;
Mose - 12th dyn;
Dave - 18th dyn?;
Solomon - 18th/19th dyn?;
Shishak - 19th dyn;

Nimrod ~ Aurignacian/Magdalenian
- (tall/strong, hunter, capelid/sumerian)
Abraham ~ Azilian
- (Beersheba)
Joseph ~ Lake Dwellings
- (Egyptian wheat/dried-up lake shores)
Moses ~ Megalithic
- (bedstead of Og of Bashan)

The closest possibility I have so far found for king C(h)(o)ushan-ris(h)at(h)a(y)im of Judges 3 is king S(h)u-shin of 3rd dyn of Ur (incld Akkad & Assyria), though rishathaim is perhaps similar to diblathaim (r/d intchge, sh/b cipher)? (Compare: Cush = Kur; Gozan (Gu-edin?/Gud-ana?). Perhaps risatayim relate to nasatya twins?)
(If Cushan-risathaim was an Assyrian then only close names other than Shu-shin are: [...]an [...], Erishu(m), Ashur-rim-nisheshu, Assu-ris-ilim (unverified), or Eriba-adad (b/sh cipher)?) (Compare Sheshonk?)

No direct mention is made of any Egyptian invasion/occupation of Israel/Palestine in Judges period.

Jerusalem (as opposed to Salem, cp New Jerusalem) is first so named (at latest) in David's time or (betw time of Abraham and) (before) Joshua/Judges. Mention of in ancient Egyptian 'Execration texts' of Mid Kdm Per/12th dyn, (and Amarna letters).

Could the great city Dur-ash conquered by Sargon be Jebus (Jeru-salem)? (Same sign reads either dur/dar, ip/eb, uras/urta; and Dur-ash is compared to [Dur-ilu/Dur-ili &/or] Dara-la (Eb-la).)

Sargon conquered Iarimuti which is Jarmuth of bk of Joshua, (cp Iarimuta of Amarna lets, (cp Yarmuk?)) .

Sumerian dynasties/cities (king list)/strata/periods/phases:

1.) Antediluvian lists (Waddell's ks #s 1-10):
(Anu 1) -> Eridu/Nunki -> Badtabira -> Larsa -> Badtabira -> Larak -> Sippar -> Shurupak* -> (Flood);

2a.) Isin list (Waddell's ks #s 1-37):
(Flood) -> (Anu 2) -> Kis 1* -> (Eanna);
2b.) Isin list (Waddell's ks #s 1-39):
Eanna/Uruk 1* -> Ur 1* -> Awan* -> Kis 2* -> Hamazi -> Uruk 2;

3.) ?:
Ur 2 -> Adab [1?] -> Mari;

4.) Kish list (Waddell's ks #s 1-46):
Kis 3 -> Akshak -> Kis 4 -> "Gap"* -> Uruk 3/Umma -> Agade -> Uruk 4 -> [Adab 2?] -> (Guti);

5.) (Waddell's ks #s 46-78):
Guti -> Lagas -> Uruk 5 -> Ur 3 -> Isin -> Larsa -> Babylon 1 -> Hittite -> Sealands -> Kassi 1;

6.) dyns/phases/strata:
Mid Bab -> Neo-Babylon -> Med -> Pers -> Macedon -> Antigonus -> Seleucid -> Parthian.

Moses/Exodus

2007-04-23T02:16:00.000+01:00

The main modern dates given for the exodus are:
(a) the orthodox date of 19th or 18th dyn; and/or
(b) the most popular alternative date of Velikovsky/Rohl of the 13th (or 12th?) dyn.

The extant ancient scholars dates for the exodus are:
- Manetho's of 18th dyn (Tethmosis) and/or of 19th dyn (Amenophis/Ethiopia/Osarsiph/Heliopolis);
- Cheremon's of 19th dyn (Amenophis/Phritiphantes/(Isis)/Tisithen/Peteseph);
- Lysimachus'/Tacitus' of [23/24/25] dyn (Bocchoris);
- Artapanus of ? dyn (Memphite/Chenephres/Palmanothes);
- Jashar of ? dyn (Melol/Adikam);
- Polemo of ? dyn (Apis son of Pharonaeus);
- Koran of ? dyn (Haman); and
- Josephus' of ? dyn (Thermuthis/Tharbis/Ethiopia).
(Refs: Josephus, [Massey, Fitzgerald-Lee].)

Chenephres:
- The (?corrupt/mixed) classical/church fathers tradition (of Artapanus) that associates [an] exodus with a king Chenephres says he was Memphite (dyns (1 &) 3-8);
- Rohl mis-equates him with 13th dyn (Sec Int Per, Thebes/Itj-tawy);
- There were kings called Chenephres in 5th, 6th and 7th/8th (Memphite) dyns (Carpenter, Bey);
- A another kig of 9th dyn was Kaneferre (a famine in his reign);
- a 6th dyn pyramid name Kha-nefer;
- a place Kanefer in Sinuhe story (Amenemhat, Mercatante);
- Pyramid of Amenemhet 1 called Ka-nefer (Bey);
- Memphis was also/alt called Kha-nefer (Bey);
- (some would add Chephren).

Various traditions (either genuine/accurate or corrupt/mixed) reackon that Pharaoh's daughter, Moses' adopted mother (found Moses) was called Merr(his) or Thematis or Bathia/Bithiah (cf 1 Chron 4:17); and that Moses' Ethiopian wife was called Tharvis/Adonaih?

Ancient scholars variously claimed Moses was connected with Osarsiph of Heliopolis, Tisithen, Thoth. (Freud ([Osman or Salibi]) identified Moses with (a follower of) Akhenaten.)

Osarsiph:
- The corrupt/composite tradition identifies Moses in nature with Osarsiph;
- Osar-siph is said to compare with Jo-seph in name;
- Osarsiph story corresponds in nature with that of A(a)r(u)su/Irsu of inscriptions about 19th-20th dyn, (name "a corruption of");
- Osarsiph may be Se-Osiris?

The modern 19th dyn theory was based in partly on the name Ramses, and on the traditional exodus of Amenophis (Merneptah). The mention of name Israel in Palestine on Merneptah stele is one known problem with this theory/dating.

If Raamses is Pi-Ramses-Meri-Amun (anachronism) then why didn't they include the Pi- since they did with Pithom (and also with Pathros/Atur-res and perhaps Buto/Put)? (also Rameses spelt different, plus also "land of" not just city.)

There are pharaohs/persons with name Ramses before 19th dyn in some other ancient/mediaeval/modern king lists published by Herman Hoeh. (Compare Remus (Rome), Rimush (Akkad).)

3/4 proposed etymologies/derivations of name Moses:
Hebrew moseh/masah "to draw out";
Egyptian msw "to be born", mesu "child, son";
Egyptian mou "water" + eses/uses "(those who are) saved (from)";
(Sumerian mus "serpent").

Wehem-meswet (12th dyn), Mer-mesha (13th dyn), Dudimose (13 dyn), Ka-mose (17 dyn), Ah-mose (18th dyn), Tuth-mosis (18 dyn), Ra-mose (18 dyn?), Sagaz-mesh (18 dyn), Ra-messes (19th-20th dyns), Amen-messes (19 dyn), (Ptah-)Messu (19 dyn), Pa-ra-messu (19 dyn?).

[The DSS and] Psalm 78:43 mention Tanis in connection with Hebrews in Egypt (compare Jashar).

Some Xtian scholars believe the Pharaoh of Exodus was an Assyrian quoting some biblical verse(s) some where.

The new king that didn't know Joseph could be a new/different period or dynasty or "race" (Horus/Set) or capital/origin.

Could the 80 yrs Horus vs Set poss be related to the 80 yrs of Moses in exodus 1-14?

Also/alt, king Pepy/Phiops (6th) dynasty was a centenarian like Joseph & Moses.

melol/adikam ("bk of Jashar") & pepy (6th dyn) have in common 94 yrs, dwarf/pygmy, (tanis?)

The new king that didn't know Joseph/the Pharaoh of the massacre of babies could have reigned anywhere between ca 40 yrs ("after Moses was grown") upto 80 yrs (poss (not) longer?) The pharaoh drowned in red sea could have reigned anywhere between 1/(0) yr(s) upto ca 40 yrs.

In Exodus the Hebrews slaves made bricks (not stones). In Egyptian history brick buildings/monuments were particularly prevalent/prolific in the [1st intmed per to] mid kdm per (see P Clayton, Bey).

If Goshen/Ramses/Pithom were in ne/lower Egypt as most commonly held then Moses can only have been in dyns 1, 3-8 or (12-)14-16. However this is only if one only goes by the royal capitals/centers/homes of the dynasties and not all the other cities/sites assoc with them. Baby Moses' hidding/(birth?) place must have been near pharaoh's daughter's palace, otherwise it would be like princess of Buckingham palace finding a baby in the river Trent.

No Nile river crossing mentioned in exodus.

Mention of "12 wells" or "reservior of 12 perches in a wood" in 11th dyn might be the "12 springs" (& 70 palms) of Elim of exodus?

Judaeo-Xtian vers: Moses parts/Israel crosses Red Sea (is said other countries heard of it).
Phoenician vers: Baal versus Yamm (&/or = Flood).
Egyptian vers: [Typhon in Serbonis (Arish).] The magician Zazamankh parted lake/placed one half on other. (Compare Achthoes eaten (&/or Menes devoured) by a crocodile???)

Candidates for pharaoh perished in Red sea incld:
- Mentuhotep 3, tomb/sarcophagus never found.
- Cheops empty "sarcophagus" (grt pyr) [but prob underneath pyr (Herodotus), or overseas?]
- No mummy or coffin has been found for the last Pharaoh of the 13th Dynasty, Koncharis.
- Amenemhet 4 no definately ascribed/known burial/pyramid.
- "Sesostris' mummy never found. (His grave had been ranscaked)" (I Lissner.)

Some believe the Ipuwer Papyrus parallels the 10 plagues, and/or the Sinaitic inscriptions parallel verses of exodus wanderings.

The story of Sinuhe is similar to flight of Moses, and name like Sinai?
The tale of 2 brothers Anpu vs Bata has similarity to Moses slaying the Egyptian.

"Bedstead" of giant Og of Bashan = megalithic.
Amorite Bashan poss equals Amorite Jebel Bishri (compare king Labasher of Uruk 1)?
Could "the haq of the land of Abesha/Abishai/Abushar" (Aamu) of the well-known Khnumhotep pictures be related to Og of Bashan (Amorite)? [Other candidates for Abishai/Abushar are Abisare of Larsa, Abieshu of Babylon 1.]

The slaying of the *"chosen"* or "1st born" parallels Pharaoh's slaying of children of Israel.

Candidates for slain 1st born of Pharaoh might be:
- Amenemhet 4 presumed died prematurely. Dyn 12 ends with Queen.
(Perhaps compare "who has overcome death" of Khnumhotep inscription?)

Exodus was a flight as opposed to (Hyksos) expulsion.

Judaeo-Xtian versions: Pharaoh slaughters male babies (Moses). Herod slaughter of innocents (Jesus).
Greek version: Kronos swallows children (Zeus).

At Kahun were found wooden boxes containing babies, under floors of houses (ref F Petrie/D Down). [Tho Exodus says babies were thrown into Nile river. Perhaps were fed to crocodiles hence Sobek of 12th dyn?]

Judaeo-Xtian version: Moses saved from water (Nile).
-> Roman: Romulus & Remus saved from water (Tiber) (Pears/Cook).
-> Akkadian: Sargon 1 saved from water (Hancock).
-> Egypt: Hancock sees parallel with rescue of Osiris coffin from water.

Moses lawgiver/laws similar to Hammurabi lawgiver/laws.
Judaeo-Xtian Moses lawgiver.
Babylonian Hammurabi lawgiver.
Greek/Cretan Minos lawgiver. Draco lawgiver. Lycurgus lawgiver.
Egyptian: Menes 1st lawgiver (Brugsch-Bey).
Indian code of Manu.

Could the "stor(ag)e/treasure places/cities" (Raamses, Pithom) of Exodus 1 be connected with the Labyrinth near lake Moeris? (Tho Herodotus also alt mentions treasury of Rhampsinitis.)

(Kahun was "suddenly abandoned".)

Pectoral of queen Mereret (Amenemhet 3) possibly seems to show slave workers?

Pi-thom (Pi-Tum/Pa-Tmu &/or Per-Atum) could be from either:
- a Pharaoh (Tawi-Thom ("Typhon"), Amun-timaeus, Thamus, Teutamus, Tutimaeus/Timaus, Dudimose, etc); or
- the god Atum; or
- tham/thomas "two/twin/demi", compare Egyptian taui (cognate with English) "two" as in Itj-tawi, Tawi-Thom, Ros-tau, etc.
(Pithom similar to P-ium/Faiyum tho almost certainly not same.)
Pithom is probably the "Arabian" town Patumus between Bubastis and Red sea mentioned in Herodotus. (Lower Egypt was called Patomit.)
Alt/also, temple of (Ra-)Atum at Heliopolis (Kheper-ka-ra Senusret 1). "Huge quantities of ... stores ... were found in Sesostris' funerary temple" (I Lissner).

"Moses" on the ass in the temple (compare Typhon on ass) was really prophetic for Jesus on donkey colt (which may be type of 144000 (Israel) of Revelation?).

Abraham ~ Uenephes/Semenptah (1st dyn) :
- (famine -> plagues);
Jacob ~ Nynetjer/Necherophes (2nd dyn) :
- (Shechem ~ Shem-Re????, "terror");
Joseph ~ (betw Zoser to) Sneferu (3/4 dyn) :
- (famine Zoser?, bent pyramid, Rahotep, global);
Moses ~ 12th dyn :
- (12 springs, slave workers?, brick buildings, temple Atum, new kdm/dyn/king, giant?, ....)

There is dispute whether the 400 or 430 yrs sojourn of the Hebrews in Gen-Exod was either:
(A) 430 yrs in Egypt alone as in Masoretic text; or
(B) 430 yrs in "Egypt and Canaan" (Septagint), or, 215 yrs (Jacob - Mose) in Egypt, and 215 yrs (Abe - Jose) in Canaan (Josephus, [DSS]).

Perhaps it is possible to adopt a provisional compromise/synthesis of ~300 yrs in Egypt?

Comparing geneaologies, there are more generations between Joshua/Caleb/etc and their tribal patriarch (11) than there are between Levi and Moses/Aaron (2/4).

The Jewish date of 2666 for exode may be related to 666 like massoetic 1656 date for flood?

Some have made a deal/case of 400 yrs of Genesis vs 430 yrs of Exodus, however 400 & 430 are interchangeable (rounding off) as with 40/42 in same system as 10/12, 50/52, 70/72, 100/110/120.

(4 generations to 400 yrs gives a generation of 100 yrs. The 4 generations may be types of 4 world ages?)

(Egypt/Arab: Surid built pyramid 300 yrs before flood (A Tomas).)
(300 yrs reign god-king Horus (Alford).)
350 yrs reign god-king Set (Alford).
350 yrs chaos betw demi-gods dyn & Menes.
400 yrs Messiah (2 Esdras 7:28).
400 yrs between Hyksos king and king of 19th egyptian dynasty (Massey).
400 yrs old Crow "phoenix" of Hor-Apollo (Massey).
420 yrs Noa to Abe.
430/400 yrs abe/jose - mose (exo 12:40, gen 15:13)
430 yrs gap in Sumerian king list that Waddell theorises.
436yrs bef 1st olymp, nilus reign (Massey).
448 yrs 4th dyn Manetho (Clayton);
450 yrs betw Christ and Galahad (E Blyton).
450/400 yrs reign of god-king Osiris (Massey, Alford).
480 yrs moses-solomon (1ki6:1)
490 yrs Daniel - Christ (Dan 9:24).
500 yrs reign god-king Geb (Alford).
511 yrs Hyksos (Josephus/Manetho).

7 Days Creation, etc

2007-04-22T08:15:00.000+01:00

Judaeo-Xtian vers:
7 remaining horns beast,
7 heads beast,
7 sons Job;
7 yrs Joseph,
Jacob served 7 yrs;
7 yrs Tribulation,
7 dispensations,
7 Cainite generations (Seth 8th),
7 days creation,
menorah,
7 churches,
7 archangels,
7 sons Japheth (Jashar),
wk of 7 yrs,
7 days week,
7 churches Paul (letters),
7 animals ark,
7 gens Abe - Moses (Josephus),
7 gens Adam - Enoch (Jude),
7 spirits,
7 deacons,
7 names God,
7 last words Jesus,
7 days festivals/feasts,
7 weeks betw passover & pentecost,
forgive (70 x) 7 x,
Cain/Lamech cursed -fold/x,
Israel/Jews extended punishment x7,
7 earths (Jewish),
[7 cities Nimrod],
7 sons Mizraim (Jashar);
7 daughters Jethro/Raguel/Hobab;
7 sephiroth (Myers),
5 loaves & 2 fish[es],
Hebron built 7 yrs before Tanis;
7 yrs Hebron, David.

Yaldabaoth engenders 7 beings,
7 stages Sufism,
7 stages islamic hell (Sykes),
7 heavens islam/gnostic (Cooper, Room, Jordan),
7 zenobias (B Walker),
7 heads Lotan/Leviathan (Sykes, Larouse),
7 headed serpent Phoenican (Waddell),

7 days Babyl flood,
7 tablets creation,
7 stages Tower of Babylon/Borsippa,
7 Maskim,
7 septenary spheres/"stars/planets"/heavenly bodies,
(Ningirsu/Ninurta slays) 7 headed snake-monster/serpent/dragon Sumerian/EDP (Heidel, Black & Green),
7 annunaki,
7 gates underworld,
7 spheres/grades Mithraism mysteries,
[7 metals/tree Avesta],
7 Amesha Spentas (Sykes);

7 Manus,
7 rivers India,
7 (sapta)mataras,
7 spurs Meru (Sykes),
7 circles Patala (Sykes),
7 Rishis (Sykes)?,
7 Prajapatis (Sykes)?,
7 horses Surya (Jordan),
7 root races theosophy,
7 gods of luck Japan.
7 thunders spring from corpse of Izanami.

7 rivers Egypt,
7 hills pre-dyn Egypt pottery,
7 castes Egypt,
7 Hathors,
7 cleopatras,
7 holes head,
7 gods invoked at daybreak (Zaire),

Apollo,
7 sages (Solon),
7 Pleiades/sisters,
7 against Thebes,
7 pairs youths sacrificed to Minotaur,
7 cyclopes built Tiryns,
7 Hyades (Cooper),
7 islands Persephone,
Sibyl 7 gens old;
7 days exode Tacitus;
7 hills Rome,
7 kings Rome,
7 Caesars (Westminster NT),
7 wonders world,

7 heads Rugievit,
Oossood pronounces destinies on 7th nt aft birth,
7 sleepers,
G7,
7 champions Xtendom (Cooper),
7 deadly sins,
7 swords (R Carpenter)???,
7 dwarves,
7 climate zones ([Natl Geogr/Time?]),
777,
7 aeons (ONA),

7 cities Cibola (Sykes),
Chicomoztec cavern of 7 chambers (Sykes),
7 caves tulan-zuiva (Sykes).

7 seas,
7 continents,
7 nitrogenous bases DNA,
7 caves Mars,
earth 7th planet counting inwards,
7 colours rainbow,
7 tones,
7 vowels (...),
7 senses (Cooper),
7 stars Ursa major,
7 day week ~ 1/4 of month.

There are 2 views about the 7 day creation week of Genesis 1, they are: that the 7 days were literal 24 or 12 hour days, or that they were (any length) ages/periods like 1000 yrs (yome meaning day &/or (cognate?) aeon).

7 literal days would explain the origin of the 7 day week, (moon not created til # day).

In many cases 8 is really "7 &/+ 1", which in many cases means "new".

8 kings/heads beast (Rev 17),
8 days old circumcision,
8th day man Adam,
888 numerological value Jesus Christ (Anderson),
Seth 8th following after 7 Cainite generations (Massey, O'Brien),
8 souls saved in Noah's ark,
David 8th son of Jessie,
8th/(1st) day JC resurrected (Oxford);

8 children Keret (Larouse),
"Eshmun 8th to 7 sons of Sydyk, Sydyk god of 8 rays" (Massey)?
8 stages Islamic paradise (Sykes),
Borsippa Nebo Ziggurat 8 spheres/stages/steps,
8 nagus/regions Babylonian world map (Black & Green),
8 pted star istar (Jordan, Bolton),
8 (asta)mataras,
8 Lokapalas/Dikpalas (Sykes),
8 vasus (Sykes, Jordan),
noble 8-fold path Buddhism (Pears/Cook),
8 Buddhas (Comte, Larouse),
8 hand crow Yatagarasu (Sykes),
Susano vs 8 headed serpent (Larouse).

8 gods Ogdoad Hermopolis (Jordan),
8 faces Bent Pyramid;
8 spokes chariot wheel Nuweiba,

[8 (x 3) runes,]
8 legged horse Sleipnir (Jordan),
88 h(eil )H(itler), 18 A(dolf )H(itler),
"8th" continent Atlantis (Berlitz),
8 hour day,
88 keys,
octave,
8 legs spiders,
8 legs octopus,
8 corners cube,
88 days Mercury,

10 Patriarchs, etc

2007-04-22T08:13:00.000+01:00

10 pre-flood Sethite patriarchs (Fasold);
10 lost tribes;
10 commandments/words decalogue;
10 times "and God said", words to create world (Oxford);
10 horns/crowns/kings beast Daniel/Revelation;
10 plagues exodus;
10 post flood patriarchs (Josephus);
10 parts/divs world/age (has come to 10th, half 10th remains) (Ethiopic 2 Esdras);
10 per cent tithes;
10 gens Judah - David (Misler);
10 strings harp (Misler);
10 sons Haman;
10 Canaanite peoples Genesis (later reduced to 7, Misler);
110 yrs Joseph/Joshua;
1 yr & 10 days flood (Fasold, Amp.);
10 righteous men (Sodom/Abraham);
Joseph/Joshua 110 yrs old;
10 cities decapolis;
10 asses Denarius (Ottenheimer);
10 kings of the Adites (Fasold);
10 antediluvian kings Berosus (Fasold );
10 day banquet Bab new year festival of Akitu (9th day Marduk split Tiamat) (Alford);
10 Prajapatis (Cooper);
10 petris (9 Brahmadikas + Brahma) (Fasold);
10 (9 + 1) avataras Visnu, Indian (Sykes);
10 Pranas (5 Jnanendriyas + 5 Karmendriyas) India (Sykes);
10th day victory (after 9 days fighting) of Durga (Alford);
10 (9 + 1) suns Chinese (Larouse );
10 emperors Chinese (Fasold, );
10 hand spans long sword;

10 base/factors decimal (Semitic/Egyptian) system;
10 god-kings dyn Egyptian (Nordbergen);
10 day week Egypt (Alford );
10 (or 9) bows/arcs earth divided into (Egyptian,) (Spanuth);
10th day (after 9 days tempest) Shu (Hancock, Alford);
Dogon: "star of 10th moon" (Alford);

10 kings of Atlantis;
10 years Trojan war (Cook);
10 years Titanomachia war (Cook);
10 orig labours of Hercules (RL Green);
10 sibyls Varro (Cooper, Cook);
10 Dactyls (Cooper);
10 curiae Rome (Bolton);
10 Caesars (Westminster NT)?
10 months to a year originally (cf Numa, ref Fasold, );
10 (9 + 1) worlds/trees Eddaic (Brita-Titchenal/Bolton);
10 years to a decade;

10 kings Canary Is (Berlitz);
10 kings Maya (Berlitz);

10 "fingers"/digits/toes hand/foot;
10 - planet X;
10 dimensions (Milser);

Ten is some times interchangeable with 12 in the same manner as [40/42, 50/52,] 70/72, 100/120.

Note: (10) horns beast = lost tribes = sons haman (types).

The theory that the 2 lines of pre-flood patriarchs (7 cainite & 10 sethite) are really same (leading to/from that genesis is not true/original) has the problems that: (a) the orders (and spellings) are somewhat different, (b) the 2 lines are concurrent/contemp/coextant &/or consecutive (seth 8th aft 7 cainites), (c) one is 7 gens other is 10, (d) wife/mother of noah/son.

Num(b)er(olog)ical Symbolism, part 3, Analysis and Conclusions.

historical:
- prooves 3 sons Noah,
- prooves 10 patriarchs.

religious/holy:
- prooves trinity,
- prooves judaeo-xtianity/bible/God (7s, 3s, code signature fingerprint).

chronological:
- can help solve chronological uncertainties by giving us an alternative time-scale to geological one, arising from evidence that ancients viewed human/world time/history (& prophecy) as a whole, (sub-)dividing it into varying #s of consecutive ages analogous to micro sub-divisions/units of time.

geographical:
- can help to locate lost lands (eg Atlantis); evidence that ancients known/inhabited world was whole world not old world, which they (sub-)divided into # of continents/latitudes/hemispheres/worlds/quadrants like we do.

cultural/racial:
shows connections between various cultures/civilisatons (eg "aryan" tripartite caste system common to many; eg conns betw old wor & new wor; atlantean).

metaphysical/mystical/cosmology/scientific:
dimensions, principles/energies/forces.

Abraham

2007-04-15T01:49:00.000+01:00

The main extant chronologies place Abe-Jose too late (in Egyptian & Mesopotamian time lines) in my opinion. (They gen place Abe betw Ur 3 to Babylon 1 periods, and they put Jose betw 12th to 16th dyns.) Abraham lived only 400 yrs after flood, and at the end of longevity/(beginning of civilisation?).

The 2 droughts in (supp) "predynastic-postglacial" Egypt (2nd one corresp to Anau 2-Susa 2) acc to Cambridge Anc Hist, may be the droughts/famines of Abraham, Isaac &/or Joseph of Genesis? (Likewise with drought at Jericho between Natufian & Munhata/Yarmukian phases.)

Abraham may be contemporary with the 1st dyn of Egypt. According to Genesis 12 there was a bad famine followed by egypt/pharaoh being smitten by bad plagues. In the 1st Egyptian dyn the was a bad famine followed by a bad plague (and miracles). One possible problematic difference is that plagues is plural in genesis but singular in 1st Egy dyn (ref Bey), though Clayton does say "numerous plagues". (Also a problem if Waddell is right equating 1st dyn with the dyn of Akkad in Mesopotamian king list?)

On another hand Abraham could be Philitis of 4th egyptian dyn period, (see Herodotus)? Philitis was a shepherd and name means lover of righteousness, and Abe was called righteous in bk of Hebrews, (rather than P being Melchi-zedek as some in past claimed). <[Mastaba] mentioned in bible prophet book.>

Could (Su-)edin(-hum) (Subartu*/[Sumasti]/S(h)irihum/Suedinki/Subati/'Suedin & Gutium') of Sumer-Akkadian records be connected with Sodom? (LA Waddell reckoned suedinhum is Indus Valley. Su- can mean south.) In Genesis Sodom is said to be like Garden of the Lord (Eden, cp holy land). (Edin synoym Rom, d/r intchge.) Sodom was at Dead Sea, Suedinhum was near lower sea/nar marratu (salt/bitter [cp sea of death].)
* Many believe Horites of Transjordan were Hurrians, [mt Hur(r)um ~ mt Hor?].
* Su(edin) & Gu(tium) ~ Sodom & Gomorrah???
(Faint poss even that Sodom might be related to Solymi of Tacitus (Josephus)/Homer?)

Amadgal ("Akurgal", "son" of "Ur-nina") who is connected with Suedinhum could be Amraphel with d/r intchge, and g/p(h) as in Velikovsky's Apophis/Agag (Massey's Apophis/Akhekh, cp peleg/chalag; lupus/lykos; ahi/ophis, khent/fent)?
5/4 "sons" on [Ur-nina/Uruash] plaque perhaps 5 subject kings of valley &/or 4 confed ks? Lidda on plaque could be Lot?
Chedor-laomer could be Uruash Khad ["Ur-nina/Ur(uash)-nungal/Urlugal"]. King of Elam may corresp to lord of edin/anshan (persepolis)/indus as that king apparently was. (Chedorlaomer may be Arab Sheddad son of Ad & bro Luqman, and [Uruash Khad] is allegedly assoc with word [Ad].)
However possible problem is this depends on whether Waddell was right to equate:
uruash-khad (inscriptions) = ur(uash)-nungal/urlugal (uruk 1) = urnina/urnanshe (lagas [2])?

(Also/alt, Sargon is mentioned quelling a revolt there [suedinhum]; Sargon or Naramsin or Manishtusu conq Elam; Sayce says one of Sargon's names/titles was Dadil/Dadal/Ta(l)tal similar to Tidal, (and which resembles Daedalus, and Bristowe reckons Sargon conq Crete or Cyprus). Abraham and Sargon both connected with Ur name and fire worship.)

On another hand, could Tirigan of Gu-ti-um possibly be Tidal k of Goiim of Gen 14? (cp Sum gud/Heb goy/Engl cow.) In Hebrew d & r often interchange, and so do l & n, while Sumerian g is often dropped/added. (There was a k of early Lagas called Taltal-kur-gala; Guti period/dyn tied with late Lagas period/dyn.) Apparently there was a 12 yr famine/drought immediately before Tirigan. There was a famine/drought in gen chapter 12. Abe was 75 in ch 12, and next is 86 in ch 16, plus ch 14 says the ks served Elam for 12 yrs. It might make sense that they would rebel at end of famine/drought (and why took til yr 14 for response)? Tirigan is described as "the king who perished in the midst of his troops" vaguely similar to Abram routing the 4 kings. Tirigan's predecessor was "k of the 4 regions" - 4 kings of gen 14?

The usual old identifications for the 4 confed kings were:
Amraphel/Shin(g/e)ar - Hammurabi/Shumer;
Tidal/Goiim - Tudhaliyas/Goyim (Hittite/Hatti);
Arioch/Ellasar - Eri-Aku (Rim-Sin)/Larsa;
Chedorlaomer - Kudurlagamari (Kudurnakhunte/Kudurtakhunte about the time of Ur 3 dyn or Larsa dyn).
We can see the names are not necessarily as close as felt.

Judeao-Xtian version: Lot's wife turns back, turned into pillar of salt/vapourised.
Greek version: Orpheus looks back, wife lost.

Perhaps compare Japanese: Izanami burnt to death by birth of fire god; Izanagi warned not to look at her too closely. (Some BIs suppose Japs are descs of Lot/Transjordan tribe).

Judaeo-Xtian versions: God rains fire and brimstone down on Sodom & Gomorrah etc, Lot's wife turned to pillar of salt/vapourised. (Cp Abe saved from fiery furnace.)
Mesopotamian: 'fire and stones'.
Mesopotamia: floor of fused glass bottom of all strata of archaeological mine shafts (Berlitz). Remains of tower of Babel are vitrified indicating huge amount of heat (G Jeffrey). "... thunder ... the casing of burnt bricks" (Borsippa, Nebuchadnezzar inscript) [burnt from catastrophe &/or from sun/fire when making?]
Gobi: vitrified soil of type caused by atomic explosion (Berlitz).
Mexican vers: rain of fire (& gravel)/fiery rain ends # world age (Quiahuitl).
Greek vers: Phaethon almost sets world on fire. Phoenix. Monster Aegides vomitd flames in Phrygia spread far as India then Lebanon and as far as Egypt and Africa. Semele burnt to death. (Compare Medusa head turn people who look to stone.)
Celtic: Druid myth tells how fire & water prevail over earth (Hislop, Sykes).
India: Aurva created from thigh great consuming fire which would have consumed world....
Arabia/Palestine: Quite a few authors have given evidence that the whole Sinai, Negeb, Petra, Dead Sea, Lawz and El-Wijh area are burnt/scorched/seared/blackened/dessicated/scared/ash & lava fields (Alford, Murray, Jeffrey, Oommen, Cornuke).

Gomorah/Amorah might be Numeira (David Down [n/g intcge or n- prefix]; cp Qumran?)

Could Ben-Yamini of Mari recs be Ben-Ammi/Ammonites (rather than "stherners" or Ben-jaminites)???, &/or Ben-Sam'ali of Mari recs be Ishma-elites (rather than "ntherners")???

Ram caught in thicket of Abe/Isaac story supposedly resembles "ram in thicket" of Ur city tho the latter otherwise called 'goat with tree of life'. (Perhaps compare Mendes of 2nd dyn of Egypt.) Zodiacal age of Aries (cp Khnum (3rd/4th dyn), Amun (12th, 18th dyns))?

Hebron was built 7yrs before Tanis (Num 13:22); name of Pepy (6th dyn) found at Tanis meaning town at least that old.
Earlier name of Hebron was Kirjath-Arba "city of four" which is similar to Akkadian shar kibrdtim arba'inm erbettim "king of the 4 quarters".

Abe (roughly) came immediately after end of extreme longevity. Gilgamesh of Uruk 1 came immediately after end of extreme longevity. Pepy, Djedi, Gilgamesh were centenarians (like Joseph and Moses).

Azilian letters on pebbles found at/under Beersheba, and Beersheba is connected with time of Abraham/Hagar, possibly meaning Abe and Azilian close time-wise.

There is a strange similarity of Abraham and Sarah/Sarai with Brahman and Sri of India.

([Salibi or Osman]'s Asir in Arabia is biblical Asshurim sons of Abraham (not Assyria), not Israel.

Continental Shift(s)

2007-04-12T22:38:00.000+01:00

Orthodoxy says continental drift, others say continental sprints/shift(s), some say cont "drift"/shift is only theory. Evidences of sudden continental shift(s)/sprint(s) not (just) drifting:

-Sudden shift could have triggered volcanic eruptions cp Thera, iridium, tachylite/cinder/ash mid-Atl ridge, tektites.

-Shift would cause earthquakes cp Atlantis/Athens, Easter I, Nazca, Stonehenge damaged from [sw], Minoan, collapsed/bent pyramid.

-Shift would have caused tidal waves cp Ur/Kish flood strata.

-Sudden continental shift would have caused sea/lakes to slosh over land as testified by Hopi myth, bible, sea salt petrified mastodon bones near Bogota, whale bones in USA, muddy sea, Tiahuanaco flood.

-These catastrophies would have caused sudden mass extinctions of prehistoric megafauna cp mass graves in Siberia, Gobi, [Alaska], [Mexico/Texas].

-Sudden shift would have caused warmer (or cooler re ice shift) oceans cp seafloor sediments.

-Cont shift would have wrinckled/crested up mountain ranges cp Rockies/Cascade/Coast/Cordillera, Andes, Grt Div Rge, Himalayas, mid-Atlantic ridge.

-Sudden continental shift would explain migration patterns of birds/lemmings/eels/butterflies, which are exactly the same as ancient ships going out to look for Atlantis where it once was in vain.

-Evidence from Andes that shift happened contemp with humans/civ incls Tiahuanaco, nets/pottery/stone implements/cloth in strata/cross-bedding, staircase.

- recently discovered hole/hot spot in mid-Atlic crust.

-Cp catastrophic turning inside out of Venus.

- altered alignments; seeming sky/moon/stars falling/standing still; seeming sinking Atlantis.

Bible, myth, science etc give/are evidence that all the continents broke up and shifted from one common original supercontinent.

- Judaeo-Xtian vers: Earth (land &/or people) divided in days of Peleg.
- Mesopotamian vers: Ki means cleave [gap/gulf]. [Tiamat] cut in half by [Bel].
- Egyptian vers: Osiris cut into 14 pieces. Thoth "the er", (D Fasold.)
- Maori vers: Maui's bros cut up fishes back making valleys & mountains.
- floating islands. world egg opened.
- Classical vers: Zagreus torn to pieces by Titans. Zeus, Poseid, Hades, (Persephone, Athena, Hephaestus) divide up earth/Gaea between them; 3 islands of Z, Poseidonis, H.

3 sons of Noah; &/or Trinity

2007-04-07T13:00:00.000+01:00

- Cabalist/Judaeo-Xtian/Biblical versions:
Cain, Abel, Seth?
Tubal, Jubal, Jabal?
3 levels Ark.
3 sons of Noah: Shem, Japheth, Ham, (+ Noah = 4th).
Nimrod, Joktan, Fenech (Charlesworth).
Abram, Nahor, Haran?
Abraham visited by 3 angels;
Abram, Eleazar, Isaac (Milser).
3 patriarchs: Abram, Isaac, Jacob.
Ahiman, Sheshai, Talmai.
Daniel 3rd in kdm.
Shadrach, Meshach, Abednego.
3 ribs bear (Dan).
3 uprooted horns beast.
Gaspar, Melchior, Belshazar.
Moses, JC, Elijah.
Peter, James, John.
3 crosses: Thief, JC, Thief (Jantsang).
3 days JC: died, buried/Sat, rose/Sun.
Holy, Holy, Holy (Misler).
Was, Is, Is to Come;
Antichrist, False Proph, Dragon.
666.
Trinity/Godhead: Father, Son, Holy G/S.
Sinoptic gospels: Mt, Mk, Lk.
3 OT grps/divs: law & prophets & writings/other/rest.
Kether, Binah, Hokhmah (Myers).
[Geburah, Tipereth, ....]
Body, soul, spirit.
3 divs templ: Holy of Holies, inner court, outer court.
3 letters YHWH.
Judaism, Xtianity, Islam.
3 consonant/letter roots.
3 Teachers of Righteousness (J Jewell, ).
Saducees, Pharisees, Essenes.
3 heavens (D Prince, ).
1/3rd vs 2/3rds angels.
poss 3 intended bks Luke's.
3 1/2 yrs tribulation.
time, times, half time.
Jesus ministry 3 yrs.

- Hittite version:
3 sons Anus/Kumarbis: Tesub, Tasmisu, Aranzah (Lehman, Larousse.).

- Phoenician version:
Chronus, Potos, Omicle (Sykes).
Phos/light, Phur/fire, Phlox/flame.
Athirat, Anat, Asherah (Jordan).
Qre, Ashima, ... (Graves).
Tripoli.

Allat, Uzza, Manat (B Walker, Chick).

- Babylonian versions:
Tiamat, Apsu, Mummu (Heidel).
Ea, Anu, Bel (Black/Green, ).
Sin, Samas, Istar/Adad (Sykes, Sayce).

-Iranian version:
3 sons of Thraetaona/Feridun: Eraj, Salm/Sayrima, Tur.
Rashnu, Mithra, Sraosha (Sykes).
3 saviours: Saoshyant, ..., ... (J Jewell, Larouse).
Creation, Mixture, Separation.
3 parts Avesta (Sykes).
tripitaka.

- Indian versions:
heads snake Ahi (Cooper);
Brahma, Visnu, Siva.
3 sons of Manu: Sama/Scherma, Chama, Pra-Jyapeti (S Bristowe.)
Rajas, Tamas, Sattva (radio).
Indra/Vayu, Agni, Surya (Sykes, C Cook/Pears).
3 wives: Ganga, Sarasvati, Jumna/Lakshmi (Cotterell).
3 aryan castes: brahm, kshatr, vishya.
33 (3 x 11) devas (Jordan).
3 steps: rising, zenith, setting (Jordan, Hrozny).
3 cities/parts world: heaven, air, earth (Jordan).
3 cities: gold, silver, iron (Jordan).

Amaterasu, Susano, Tsuki-yomi (A Cotterell).

Kola, Klepio, Arvo (K Buck, ).

- Greek versions:
Chaos, Eros, Gaia (Tyson).
3 sons of Uranus & Gaia: Kronos, Titan/Typhon, Iapetos divide up earth (Bristowe.)
3 sons of Kronos & Rhea: Zeus, Poseidon, Hades.
Minos, Rhadamantys, Sarpedon/Aeacus.
Aeolos, Dorus, Xuthus.
4 legs, 2 legs, 3 legs (Sphinx).
3 hypostates: One, Mind, Soul (Scorpion).
3 intended bks Plato (Zangger).
Hermes Trismegistus.
Trident.
Stone, Bronze, Iron (Filmer, Cooper).
3 conts Old World: Europe, Asia, Libya (Herodotus).
3 Muses/castalides.
3 phases Hera: pais, teleia, chera (Jordan).
Artemis, Demeter, Hecate (Bolton)?
3 Dactyls/[chalybes?]: Smelter, Hammer, Anvil (Cooper).
3 Horae/parcae: Eunomia, Dice, Irene.
3/triple heads/bodies Hecate (Bolton).
3 Moirae/parcae/fates: Klotho, Lachesis, Atropus.
3 gorgons: Medusa, Stheno, Euryale.
3 graces/Gratiae/Charities: Aglaia, Thalia, Euphrosyne.
3 headed dog Cerberus.
3 bodied Geryon.
3 Hesperides (Cooper).
3 Erinyes/furies/Eumenides: Alecto, Tisiphone, Megaira.
3 Cyclopes: Brontes, Steropes, Arges.
3 Hecatoncheires/centimani: Cottus, Gyges, Briareus/Aegaeon.
3 Graeae.

Uni, Tin, Minerva (Sykes, B Walker).

Jupiter/Juventas, Juno, Minerva (Walker, Jordan).
Jupiter, Mars, Quirinus (Jordan).
3 tribes (Cook).
3 remaining sibylline books.
3 Horatii (Cook).
triumvirate: Julius Caesar, Pompey, Crassus.
Octavian, Antony, Lepidus.

Napoleon, Ducos, Sieyes.
Napoleon, De Cambaceres, Lebrun.
33 degrees masonry.

[3 Celt/Galli/Gaul castes/provs: (Caesar).]

- Norse versions:
Odin, Vili, Ve.
Harr, Janfar, Thrud.
Odin, Frey, Thor (Tyson).
Jarl, Karl, Thrall.
Istaevon, Ingaevon, Hermion.
Odin, Hoenir, Loder.
3 Norns: Urd, Verdandi, Skuld.
Man, Maid, Frost Giant (Branston).
[Asgard, Midgard, Jotunheim (Anderson)?]
Valknut 3 triangles (Skadi).
[3 x 8 runes.]
3 (sub-)races of Europe: Alpine, Nord, Medit, (Ripley).
3 x 8 hrs: sleep, work, ....

3 heads Triglav: heaven, earth, lower regions (Sykes).

- Egyptian versions:
Gods, Demigods, Manes.
Isis, Horus, Seb/Set (Chick).
Atum, Shu, Tefnut (Alford).
Memphite: Ptah, Seker, Osiris.
Khepri, Ra, Atum.
3 Hermes/Thoths: Set, Shu, Thoth (Massey).
Khufu, Khafre, Menkaure.
3 seasons: Inundation, Winter, Summer.
Osiris, Horus, Isis (Sykes/Mercatante).
Set, Nephthys, Anubis (Mercatante).
Theban: Amon-Re, Mut, Khensu (Sykes).
Memphite: Ptah, Sekhmet, Imhotep (Sykes).
Elephantine: Anquet, Khnemu, Sati (Sykes).
3 kingdoms: O, M, N.
Userkaf, Sahure, Neferirkare.

Maou, Lisa, Gou (Sykes).

- Tupi-Guarani version:
Guaracy, Jacy, Peruda (Sykes).

Kane, Ku, Lono/Kanaloa (Jordan).
3 fingers Maori carvings.

Trinary star (radio, ).
Earth 3rd planet from Sun.
3 phases Moon.
3 spheres: sun/solar, moon/lunar, stars/stellar.
core mantle crust.
3 lobes brain (M Godwin).
vestigal 3rd eye-lid (Cook).
[time/energy, matter, space (K Wheeler, CSF/AIG/ICR/logos/libronix).]
3 states matter: solid, liquid, gas.
3 (geographical) races: Cauc, Mong, Negr.
3 dimensions.
3 body types: ecto, meso, endo.
3 phases women.
3 stars Orions belt.
hundreds (100 - 999).
3 leaf clover.
past, present, future.
father, mother, child.

Trinity explains the origin of pluralis majesticus "us".

Noah cursed Ham because he had castrated (not sodomised) him (in the ark (after flood)?) because he didn't want earth divided up between more than 3 bros there already were, hence Noah had no further sons (Noachites/Noachians) after flood.
Noah's cursing of (Ham via) Canaan to be a slave was the source of the "Aryan" (Dumezil) tripartite caste system of the code of Manu (flood survivor, 3 sons Sama/Scherma, Chama & Pra-Jyapeti). (The sometimes 4 instead of 3 castes may be incld Noah or giants/Cainites?)

Biblical Shemites:
- Elam;
- Assyria;
- Chaldee, Hebrew, Arab, Moab, Ammon, Edom, Nabatean;
- Aramaeans/Syrians.

modern label "Semitics":
- Arab; sth Arab; Ethiopia;
- Canaan, Hebrew, Phoenicia, Punic;
- Akkadian, Assyria, Babylonian;
- Aramaic, Chaldee, Syriac, Ahlamu;
- Amorite; Ugarit; Ebla; Hyksos; biblical Hittites.

Biblical Khamites:
- Egypt, Philistines;
- Canaan, Hittites, Phoenicians, Amorites;
- Libya;
- Ethiopia, Sumer, Assyria, Babylonian, Akkadian.

modern label "Hamitics":
- Egypt, Libya, Ethiopia, Nilo-Hamites.

According to some sources Hamitic is an arbitrary/convenient grouping of 3 branches of Hamito-Semitic/Afro-Asiatic/Erythraic/Adamic (equal status with Semitic branch).

Aliens/Angels/Gods

2007-04-06T19:55:00.000+01:00

->Judaeo-Xtian versions: Sons (bene) of God (Elohim)/Watchers/Enochians/Nefilim descending from heaven (in days of Jared) and beget Giants of wickedness by fair Daughters (bath?) of men (Adam). Some Xtians believe that Antichrist will come in a UFO faking the 2nd Coming of Christ. Bk of Daniel: iron + clay = angels + humans?
-> (The biblical Tower of Babel was built to raise men up to heaven/God, &/or) the Sumerian ziggurats were built to bring the gods down from heaven.
-> Sumer: kingship desc from heaven/Anu.
-> Sumerian: Z Sitchin claims Sumerian myth says Annunaki came from planet X.
-> [Babylonian?] version: Terra-cotta men and fair women (Acknowl: T Jantsang.)
-> "gods plural before god singular" (E von Daniken).
-> Mythology traces human origins from the Great Mountain/mtns which can be figurative of heaven (& landing place mt [Hermon]).
-> [Armenian (unverified): Arevorti "sons/(children) of the sun/(light)".]
-> Indian version: Marisha d of Kandu/[Suryavansa or [serpent race]], + Prachetasas => Daksha/Pretas/Ishwara, (T Jantsang/Puranas).
-> Mongol version (creation myth): Borjigin/blue-eyed heroes children of the Blue (celestial) Wolf and the White Fallow Doe ("repr sky & earth, male & female, light & dark") (Acknowls: Hopsen, T Jantsang, S Devi, Google.)
-> China: emperor called "son/monarch of heaven". Arrival of the sons of heaven in fiery-tailed dragon ships.
-> Japan: emperor called "son/monarch of heaven".
-> winged discs; ezekiel; the egg; vimanas.

-> Theosophical version: 1st root race Astral, 2nd Ethereal (Ref: Scott-Eliot.)
-> separte creation/parallel evolution/polygenesis.
-> "tall, dark and handsome."
-> Greek version: From Uranus (sky/heaven) and Gaea (earth) come the Titans (Acknowl: J Jewell.)
-> Roman version: Romans had no women, abduct/"rape" (seduce) daughters of Sabines, Romans and Sabines thereafter become one people (Ref: Larousse, Acknowl: T Jantsang.)
-> Norse versions: Golden Age lasted until the women of Jotunheim corrupted it. Man, maid & frost giant. Wannen. (Sykes, Larousse, Branston.)
-> Baltic: sons of sky marry daughters of sun.
-> Transfirmia version: (superior) Alien beings interfered with (seeded life on earth &/or sped-up) human evolution. Scientists/scholars believe that life may have evolved on Mars.
-> Aetherians make Jesus Christ to be an Alien; (Yahweh made out to be an Alien by sub-genius society).
-> (vestal) "virgins" of the ....

-> Inca: emperors/kings called "son/children of the sun/light". Giants deprived of light.
-> Mochica: Giants landed on the coast and raped the native women, (A Alford).

-> Navaho: the daughters of Bright Star and Great Star marry the sons of the Sun and the Moon (L Stringer).

-> blue skined (robed) [& eyed, blooded] gods? (P Kolosimo.)
-> Egyptian pharaohs called "son of sun/Re".
-> Egyptian: union of Upper & Lower Egypt (red & black)?
-> The knowledge of the Dogon tribe about Sirius/Sothis (Nommo myths).
-> Benin: sons of Fa came from the sky.

-> NZ: Orthodox scholars say that the Maori myths of earlier White peoples (spirit-walkers) in NZ/Polynesia are really ETs/(smurves/fairies).

-> "sphinx"/"pyrs"/[canals]/7 caves on mars.
-> Modern day UFOs/flying saucers (which defy laws of physics).

The biblical story of the Sons of God descending & mix/mating with the fair daughters of men is debated to be refering to either Angels [= "aliens/gods"] and Adamitesses, or Sethites and Cainitesses.

"Aliens" must have either "evolved" or been created (with or without intermediate in turn transfirmian "seedings").

"Aliens" = Angels = "gods".

It is alleged that giants were not literal but exagerated/dualised/relative/deified/given features symbolically/child:adult.

Forbidden scientific & historical evidence of literal giants prooving the accuracy of the Bible &/or of "mythology" that I have collected incls:

1) Ancient human oral memories of our ancestors ("myths" & Bible) of giants eg:

-> Judaeo-Xtian: Nephilim/giants of wickedness/Gibborim, Rephaim, Anakim, Zuzims, Zamzummims, Emims, (Og, Nimrod, Goliath);
-> Norse: Etins/Jotuns, Thurses, Muspel, deformed giants, Jack & the Bean stalk;
-> Cro-Magnons tall/superior stature to today;
-> Celtic: Gogmagog;
-> Greek: Titans, Cyclopes, Gigantes, Aloeidae, Hecatoncheires;
-> Inca: giants deprived of light;
-> Mexican: Quinametzin;
-> Maori: Rapuwai.

2) Finds of ancient/prehistoric giant humanoid footprints in USA (disputed whether genuine), Sakkara in Egypt, & allegedly Australia & NZ (Gilroy disputed whether genuine).

3) Finds of (used?) "ceremonal" mega-tools in a few places around the world.

4) "impossible" ancient structures such as megaliths/stonehenge, pyramids, Baalbek. (Tho recent theories include ancient cement.)

5) "exagerated" statures of kings & gods in ancient pictures (eg Naramsin) who are called part divine.

6) Finds of giant human & animal (megafauna, gigantopithecus/meganthropus) bones/skeletons in a few places around the world (compare big wetas high altitude). (Some other recent giant humanoid bones disputed whether genuine/fake.)

7) modern sitings of creatures like big foot?

8) remnant giant features in modern pictures of persons eg Andre, Ernest Roehm, and discoveries by modern geneticists. (Compare Little John.)

9) the recent discovery of the opposite "Hobbits" in Indonesia.

Sinuhe story is reminiscent of David, were he goes up against a "mighty/strong man" ie giant.

Previously candidates for races [descendants] of giants were Cro-Magnons, Patagonians, Jutes/Nordics & Nilotics (ectomorphs).

In bible giants come between Jared (pre-fl)/(Og)/Nimrod (post-fl) and David, (tho some traditions say Adam was a giant).

Some think the biblical name Nephilim/Nefilim "fall/fell" (n- prefix (I Donnelly)?) is related to Sumer-Akkadian name Nibiru/Nabiru (also/alt compared to Hebrew &/or Nimrod), &/or Eddaic name [Niflheim/Niflhel]/Nibelung (cp Grk Nephele); [cp netherlands, nihilism?]. (Perhaps Naacal [Nachal?] (Na-chan?) (or nile/[nahar/nahal])???)

Some are seemingly suggesting that the nephilim are not the fallen angels &/or their earthly offspring because they see Gen 6:4-5 "There were nefilim/giants (of wickedness) in/on the earth in those days and after that when the sons of God came [NWT "continued"] .... The Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth...." as possibly implying they were "in" the earth before the angels descended, [tho perhaps "- and after -" (Amp) is post-flood?]. There is seemingly a distinction in myth between 2 kinds/races/types of giants: earth-born, and offspring of heaven (& earth)? Some add that there is a tradition that Adam was a giant; and that there was a (connected) decline in stature/size, IQ/memory and lifespan/longevity (cf wetas). The [metal age] dwarves/elves of some mythologies are perhaps our type of modern humans in relative comparision to the [stone age] giants.

Derek Prince once suggested that the mixing was occult rather than/as well as physical/sexual/literal.

Josephus & Genesis 6:5 seem to confirm that the nefilim were humans (Adamite descs, Josephus says specifically Sethites).
Thus we have reached a synthesis that has both the sons of God/daughters of men interpretations (Angels/Adamitesses, Sethites/Cainitesses) (and explaining origin of Sethites/Cainites one), adding an extra category to other 2 making 3 categories: the Nephilim/giants of wikedness, the descended Angels and the offspring of angels & daughters.

(Adam via) earth cursed -> Cain cursed -> Lamech -> men defy name of lord (Enosh) -> nefilim/giants of wickedness -> mixing with fallen angels -> offspring angels -> (Ham via) Canaan cursed -> hunter against the lord.

There are a number of different types/levels/degrees of giants/angels/gods/aliens in myth:
- nefilim, - descended angels, - pre-flood offspring of angels & humans, - post-flood giants, ....

Mixing also went on between angels/men and beasts/animals/creatures (cp Omoroka/Thalath myth, ape-men?).

Some say the bible doesn't give a clear/definate account about the creation of the angels (when). I came across a theory of my own that the beasts/creatures/animals created (and named by Adam) in Gen 2 might be the angels? (or the stars of Gen 1 might be?) Angels are called creatures/flies in a couple of places in bible. Cherubs said to have 4 faces ([lion, bull, man/angel, serpent]). The serpent Nahash of Gen 3 is supposed to be Satan. Gen 6:7 says God will wipe out beasts/birds in Flood.

Acknowledgements:
petros koutoupis (origins of the nephilim); derek prince, erich von daniken, zecharia sitchin, chuck misler (66 40), f josephus, alan alford, john jewell, peter kolosimo (timeless earth), dodona, jc cooper, rex gilroy, roy alan anderson, sydney bristowe, jamie, wierville, andrew collins,

Noah's Flood

2007-04-05T22:12:00.000+01:00

-> Judaeo-Xtian version Noachian Great Flood, ark lands at Ararat. Samael's Flood of genesis 1: .
-> Indian version: Matsya forewarns Manu Vaivasvata of flood.
-> Iranian version: Yima warned of flood by Ahura Mazda, builds cave refuge in mtns (var). (Ref: E Sykes.)
-> Arab version: Adites drowned in 2nd flood. Ark lands at .
-> Phoenician version: Baal vs Yamm (sea/river). (Ref: Larousse.)
-> Thai version: pesi. (F Comte.)
-> Japanese version: Izanagi & Izanami fish up Japan islands from ocean.
-> Chinese version: Yu. Pictograph/ideograph for boat = vessel + 8 + mouth; for flood = water + total; for total = 8 + united + earth. (Ref: Larousse, .)
-> Taiwan: Peiroun warned of deluge.
-> Indus Valley seals: boat Naveya of Yi.

-> Samoyed versions: Num(itorem) sent birds to explore watery chaos at beginning of world, made land from mud that one of them brought back in its beak. (Ref: A Cotterell.)
-> Norse version: Ymir slain, blood floods world. (Ref: E Sykes.)
-> Roman version: Saturnia & Janicula/Janiculum 2 cities on either side of flood before Rome.
-> Baltic version: Pramzimas/Pramziwas.
-> Greek versions: Zeus sends flood, Deucalion escapes in ark, lands on mt Parnassus. Ogyges sought salvation from flood in mtns/heights. Atlantis. Flood erosion Argolid (& Troy #?) Triton. Flooding of the Mediterranean. (Refs: RL Green, Larousse, D Fasold; Acknowls: Plato.)
-> Black sea flood.

-> Maori version: Maui fishes up NZ/islands.
-> Pele poured out seas around Hawaii.
-> Australian Aborigine version: Rainbow Serpent connected with flood/rising sealevels. 2 ancestors of tribe emerged from heap of debris carried by the flood. (Acknowl: Natl Radio, Cotterell.)

-> Inca: Tiahuanaco flooded. Copacati submerged temples beneath l Titicaca.
-> Tupi-Guarani: Irin Mage caused deluge. Tawenduare stamped on grnd so hard that that water gushed forth in a flood.
-> Chibcha/Muyscaya: Chia flooded whole world once.

-> Quiche: Hurakan caused deluge.
-> Aztec: All humans of world age of Atl destroed in/ended by deluge. Xelhua escaped deluge by going to top of mtn.
-> Mesoamerican versions: All peoples of 1st world except Coxcox & wife destroyed by flood. Tezpi escaped flood. (RA Anderson).
-> Chiapanese: Votan/[Nahua] saved on raft at time of deluge (RA Anderson, Fitzgerald-Lee).
-> Algonkian: Manibozho took refuge on mtn when lake overflowed & submerged world.
-> Huron: Great Frog swallowed all the deluge waters.
-> Tuleyone Indian: Olle/Coyote caused flood.
-> Eskimo: Overpopn prevented by Sedna who took pleasure in drowning many men; Sedna cast overboard, sank to bottom of sea.

-> Egypt: Recollection of flood in hieroglyph of Bennu bird. Thoth sends flood. Atmu caused waters grt deep to overflow & drown everyone. Surid builds pyramid before flood. Hermes sets up 2 columns in Siriadic land one of brick & one of stone to survive fire or flood. (Hathor & Sekhmet wade in human blood), Ra floods world with beer. Sphinx rain marks? (Ref: E Sykes, G Hancock, A Alford, Mercatante.)

Similarities (minor details): bird sent out, name Noah/Num/etc, sacrifice, forewarned, mount(ain) (Ararat), etc.

The main views on the biblical Great Flood are that it was either global (&/or even also hit Mars), or only local/known world (Ur &/or Black sea &/or Mediterranean), while some say there was no Flood at all (eg "= blood").

To the contention that the word for earth used in the Genesis flood account is different to other word(s) for (whole) earth, I believe a possible explanation is that it is subtly saying "whole earth excld the ark & its passengers/cargo", man being dust/earth.
Taking the (pure) bible (& oral judaeo-xtianity) as a whole it would seem that the flood was global.
The bible says not only all earth but also under all heaven, (& all with breath of life/sinners died).
If the flood was only local then God lied that he wouldn't flood whole world again.
Why did they not seek refuge in highlands if not global?

To the contention of where all the water came from/went to (- where does water of floods today go?):

(A.) The seas were shallower before flood (as attested by early geological strata, cp sea mounts/continental edges) and hills where lower (as attested by "myths" like those of Maui & Mu).
The world surface is 7/10ths water vs 3/10ths land. The avge depth ocean 12451 ft vs avge height land above sealevel is 2300 ft. (If the surface of the earth was flat the water would stand over 7900 ft/1.5 mi deep.)
There is the Tidal Bulge theory, (bible poss implies some sort of tidal wave-like activity in "waters coming and going").

(B.) In fact some claim that even today there is almost enough water tied up in arctic & antarctic ice to subermerge the much/most of the whole world, tho ice is more expanded than water (tho ice floats and is on Antarctica). (Cp Sum-Akk myth says apsu flood waters held in a "spell/sleep" by Ea/Enki.)

(C.) Fountains of the Deep (cp caves):
Not to mention the under[ground &/or ocean] rivers of water known to modern scientists & ancient dowsers (megalithic). There are springs in the mid-Atlantic and Persian Gulf.
There is also the recently discovered Beijing anomaly (cp Churchward's subterranean gas chambers, Apsu).
"Myths" speak of the orfice thru which the flood waters drained away like a bath plug hole (cp Symmes hole(s).)

(D.) Floodgates (cataracts) of Heaven/Waters Above/Rain (Zanger):
There is also the Canopy theory that the preflood atmosphere held more water (no rain(bow)), tho I'm not sure that this theory is right.
Recent evidence/theories suggest that both/either of the exploded planet Xs (one(s) between Mars and Jupiter, and the other(s) beyond Pluto) were watery/icy (& red) planets.
It is possible water could have evaporated into upper atmosphere and been lost to space (like during Joseph's drought) as scientists say will happen in global warming (cp lunar (atmosphere) capture/"Martian rock" Antarctica).

(E.) Ancient accounts attest there were areas like Nile Delta/Lower Egypt/Suez, and Sealands that were [mud/clay] marshes/bogs/swamps after the flood that had to be reclaimed by building dykes/dams/canals/aqueducts, (cp Aral sea).

To the contention that Noah couldn't fit/feed/care for all evolved species on the ark, the flaw is that biblical kinds are not species but cross-fertile/viable levels varying between species and [order] for different animals.
Noah had 120 yrs (and God's help) to collect specimens.
For larger animals eggs or young could have been used (some say "seed" of some versions is dna).
There were 2 of [un/clean] and 7 of [un/clean].

To the contention of the traditions that the Cainites &/or Giants survived the flood (cp [Phoenix/Griffin]), the traditions are possibly really refering to the wives/mother(s) of Shem/Ham/Japheth/Noah (polygamy).

It was said by some authors there are no Egyptian accounts of the flood, but in fact there are quite a few incld the myths of: Thoth (G Hancock), Surid, Siriadic columns, Bennu/Phoenix, Nun, Atlantis, Atum, and Ra (Sekhmet & Hathor).

Possible evidences of a global flood may incld: Oxford Clay, traces of humans/civ in every period of geological time scale at all sorts of depths, fossils, world flood is universal "myth", grand canyons, pillow lava mt Ararat, scientists believe there was a great flood on Mars, rain marks very early geological strata/period (cp Grt Sphinx & Sarmast's Cyprus), deposits of marine life on Himalayas/etc, etc.

It doesn't seem to have been noticed that the genesis account saying it rained 40 days and 40 nights may = 80 not just 40/42.
The 7 days of Mesopotamian account are confounding with 7 days of Creation week, the flood being analogous to creation (cyclic).
The Massoretic text year 1656 AM for the Great Flood may perhaps really be 1666 like the annus [mirabilis] AD 1666 being related to the 666 (or 616) of Revelation?

Yhwh was both sender and saviour while heathen split the roles between Ea/Enki vs Enlil (Zeus vs Prometheus).

Reasons why sinking of Atlantis and Flood cant be same event/time:

Reasons why Flood can't be rising sea levels at end of last great ice age:
There were 4 ice ages (in just the last of a number of ice ages), but one flood. Flood didn't come from ice but from deep &/or heaven.
Ice age seems to be mentioned after and not before Flood in bible history.

There are 3 theories re where the Ark may still be: Ararat, Durupinar, or Suleiman.

1) On Mt Ararat in Kurdistan/[Armenia] there have been quite a few modern/mediaeval sightings (incl by Fasold?) & one recorded by Josephus around the time of Christ, of a wooden cuboid object perhaps/not about the size of the Ark (compare Viking long houses/barrows).
There have also been brought back pieces/beams of wood, and there has been found pillow lava which forms under water.

2) Some people think that (a) [reed-]boat/ship shaped feature(s), called Durupinar, about 30 km SW of Ararat in Turkey/Kurdistan (near Iran border) unearthed after an earthquake in 1948, is the remains of Noah's ark (same size), though some hold that it is just one of the # of natural ship-shaped volcanic rock formations which are known of in Turkey (& Australia) (perhaps formed during the flood?) (The same claim that has been made about other anomalous archaeological sites/artefacts that threaten the System's moralistic/politically correct/ideological dogmatism, &/or that favour alternative worldviews.) (Note the shape of this object is a coffin/kite with a CROSS in it!) Fasold says there have been found quite a few drogue stones in the area, and that the modern historical siting(s) on Ararat might have been of this object easily mistaken for nearby Ararat. There have also been found in the formation metal rivets, and remains of a spoted cat not native to the area. The Turks have sealed of the site as the location of Noah's Ark.
Very ancient remains have been found at [Medzamon] & Nakhicevan nearby to these 1st 2 ark sites.

3) On Chuck Misler's radio program 66-40 (Rhema) his friend Bob Cornuke, who has been involved with searches for & discoveries of such Biblical sites/artefacts as St Paul's shipwreck, Mt Sinai, the Ark of the Covenant and Noah's ark, said that Mt Ararat was only nominated as the Biblical Mtns/[hills*] of Ararat and so named in AD/mid.
The Biblical name Ararat is said to be the same as the ancient kingdom of Urartu (Alarodians) which Cornuke says Assyrian records imply was further to the east around modern n.w. Iran, tho others insist that Urartu was def [only] in Armenia/Van not [also] nw Iran.
Cornuke points out Genesis says the ark landed on the mountains (plural or dual?) of Ararat (there are a # of plural mtns in mythology), [though there are twin mountain peaks called Mashu in Babylonian myth and Ararat does have 2 peaks].
He also appeals to the Genesis verse that says they migrated from the east to Babel, (tho some versions read "in (or to?) the east", and compass points may have been different then?)
Last I heard until recently was that he was planing to helicopter around a likely mountain thereabouts in hopes of finding remains of the Ark still there.
Recent news was that they found on Mt Suleiman/Elburz Mtn Range (wood fragments and/from an ancient shrine at top of mtn which unknown people had made pilgrimages to; and lower on the mountain/near) a prominent ark-like/prow-shaped/boat-shaped rock formation/outcrop, which they say resembles petrified wood, emerging from a ridge.

Tower of Babel

2007-04-05T22:09:00.000+01:00

by Larry Stringer & Sean Bambrough.

-> Judaeo-Xtian versions: 7 cities incld city & Tower of Babel up to Heaven ("gateway") built by Nimrod a gibbor/mighty hunter/archer or Cush immed/shortly after flood (or at time of Eber/Hud, Peleg or Abram), tongues confused ("confusion").
-> Indian version: a grt tree grew upto heaven, angering Brahma, who cut off its branches and threw them down. From each branch grew a sep wata tree that gave humanity another sep lang. (Ref: B Walker.)
-> Indian: Tower of Shambhala (valley). Men built a fortress, then a city on white island in the Gobi sea? (A Tomas, P Kolosimo, [cp B Stewart].)
-> Hittite version: Ullikummi, let him ascend to heaven, tall as the sky, comparable with Atlas, like a tower. (Ref: Lehman, Larousse.)
-> Iranian version: Cai Caous reared a city & palace of grt splendor, garisoned by genii, endeavoured to take heaven by escalade, destroyed by angel of god; builds palaces on Mt Elbruz, pride, his ambition is to conquer the sky. Ecbatana. (Ref: G Massey, Larousse, Herodotus.)
-> Arab versions: [Musa/Soloman]/Sheddad ben Ad a mighty man builds Ad/Urem/city of pillars, destroyed by 2nd flood. Bab el-Mandeb catastrophe. Pharaoh/Haman builds lofty brick tower. (Ref: Brugsh-Bey, Cavendish, Acknowl: T Jantsang, Sadowsky, S Deyo/R Schmidt, Berlitz.)
-> Phoenician version: Baal builds palace after defeating Yamm. (Ref: Larousse.)
-> Babylonian version (Nebuchadnezzar): Birs-Nimrud Ziggurat of Nebo (god of writing) at Borsippa (tongue tower) near Babylon built by a former king 42 ages before Nebuchadnezar, etc. Hanging Gardens. (Ref: G Jeffries/eys, Readers Digest.)
-> Akkadian: "To their strong tower, in the night, a complete end he [Enlil] made In his anger, a command he also poured out: to scatter abroad was his decision He gave a command their counsels to confuse ... their course he stopped. (A Alford.)
-> Sumerian versions: "In those days the land Shubur (East), the place of plenty, of righteous decrees, Harmony-tongued Sumer (South), the great land of the "decrees of princeship," Uri (North), the land having all that is needful, The land Martu (West), resting in security, The whole universe, the people in unison, To Enlil in one tongue gave praise." (Acknowl: "Sharrukin".)
-> Sumerian Version: Ziggurats built to bring gods of heaven down. Temple of Nippur. (Acknowl: Scorpion/M Walker/J Campbell.)
-> Chinese versions: Chihyu aspired to position of Shangti/lord of high, corrupted humans to support his rebelion, lord established a barrier between Heaven & Earth. In middle or on edge of lake someone - "Yu most certainly" - built a tower. Pagodas.
-> Japan: Izanagi & Izanami built a great palace on the island of Onogorojima, (Flem-Ath).

-> Greek versions: Aloeidae gigantes Ephialtes & Otus stack Mt Pelion on Mt Ossa in order to climb to heavens. The Titan Atla(n)s son of Libya, (upholder of vault of heaven,) invented theory of the spheres, studied the stars from/and built shrine/temple in patttern of the spheres. (Ref: C Cook/Pears.)
-> Rome: built on top of older Janicula/Janiculum & Saturnia [Golden Age] 2 cities on either side of the flood [Enoch & Babel]. (A Hislop.)
-> Sci Fi version: Star Gate [name Celtic], 7/8 chevrons. (Acknowl: TV, Up Hutt scifi club.)

-> Egypt: Grt Pyr missing cap stone? King's son of Cush.
-> Egypt/Arab/Grk/Josephus: Surid built 2 pyrs before flood. 1st Thoth/Hermes set up 2 columns in Siriadic land before flood, one of brick & one of stone to survive fire or flood [pre-flood Enoch/Janiculum & post-flood Babel/Saturnia].
-> Tanzanian version: An ancient king built a tower of Iron into the heavens, tumbled down - "rust". (Acknowl: P Schmidt/Miami Herald/Jack Wheat.)
-> African vers: an old woman accidentally strikes the high god on his foot with her pestal, causing him to retreat back into the heavens, separating the link between heaven and earth forever. The old woman gathers her children about her, and together, they build a high tower constructed entirely of pestles (ironically the very thing that severed heaven from earth in the first place). The tower was almost complete. All that was needed was a single pestle to reach the gates of heaven, but not a single pestle remained in the whole land, all had been used up, and so the tower remained incomplete. Then the old woman had a bright idea, and ordered the the bottom pestle be removed so it could be placed on the top, and of course, the towers collapsed, proving once and for all that mankind, is incapable of ever reaching heaven (Acknowl: comparative-religion.com, cotterell).
-> Yoruba: 1st/4th king Shango (ldr of grt ferocity) lived in a palace of brass.
-> Rwanda: strife between sons of Kazikamuntu accts for dispersal of men into diff tribes, (Cotterell).
-> Kabyle, Algeria: Achimi came to village built by the 1st men (Cotterell).

-> Maori version: Whare (house) in middle of fished-up fishe's back.
-> Samoan version: A man set himself to build a hse of grt stones, to last forever, but he couldn't get it finished the sun went rnd so fast, at last the "Itu or Atua" caused creeper to grow, with this the man made noose caught sun, then he built the house. People of the tree were scattered. (Refs: G Massey, A Cotterell.)

-> [British Columbia?] version: [flimsy structure to sky people?] (Ref: Mysteries book.)
-> Nth Amer: "The beasts who up to this time had spoken but one language, could no longer understand each other, and in confusion fled away ...." (Ref: L Spence.)
-> Mesoamerican versions: Votan builds tower after flood. Family of giants near Puebla built pyramid, height almost 180 feet, presumption offended gods who sent fire (fiery rain) from heaven on pyramid. The giant Xelhua (who escaped fl by going to top of mtn) builds huge tower (step pyr/zacauli at Cholula) designed to reach sky after flood. (Ref: Fitzgerald-Lee, RA Anderson, P Kolosimo, Popul Vuh.)

-> Sth Amer vers: The Chamacoco tried to climb into the sky up a huge tree. (Refs: Pears, Z Sitchin.)
-> Aymara: after the great flood strangers attempted to build a great city on the lake at Titicaca. (Flem-Ath.)

Where it says God came down to see the Tower, the Hebrew case/sense is humourous.

Cro-Magnons were hunters and "giants" like Nimrod, (compare: Sumerians were (Combe-)Capelid).

Possibility that the vitrified remains of tower of Babel are contemp/synchronous with the floor of fused glass bottom of all strata of Mesopotamian archaeological mine shafts?

Possible name connections I came up with for Nimrod/Nebrod are: Namri (a people/place around those parts in Assyrian times), Narmer (1st king united Egypt), Nimirud ([Ningishzida &/or Ningirsu]), Enmerkar (1st king of 1st Uruk dynasty), Mt Nimush (or Nisir, landing place of Baylonian ark), Nor Mard (Armenian), [mt Nemrut], or Nabiru (epithet Marduk).

Hunters/(Archers):
- Biblical version: Nimrod mighty hunter (of men/wild animals, against Lord)/[archer].
- Naram-sin bull horned helmet, bow.
- Geb.
- Saggitarius. Orion.
- Ull. Odin's/wild hunt/host.
- Herne the Hunter. Herla.
- Cro-Magnon.
- Moa hunters.

Shin(e)ar/Shin(g)ar:
S(h)umer/Sumer(ia); Dzungaria; C(h)inar; Jebel Sinjar (Yezidis); Shangrila; Senjirli (Samal); Senir (Hermon/Anti-Lebanon); [Senkereh] (Egypt); ... (Al Jazirah);

Where:
According to our/my associate's research, most accounts as to the location of the fabled Tower of Babel have placed it in Babylon (Babylonia is now the south of Iraq), or in nearby Borsippa. A more recent popular theory reckons Eridu/Nunki to be the site. However some say it is not known by any one where the T o B was, &/or we think there are conflicting reports that place the tower near the fabled mountain(s) of Ararat (Nakhicevan/Medzamon), which is plausible since this is near the legendary resting place of the great ark of Noah?

(Inter-connections):

(1.) Babel/Babylon:
The reason for this of course is that Babel is referred to as Babylon throughout the Bible, such as being near Borsippa, except when discussed allegorically as second Babylon (Rome).
David Down says Babylon ziggurat is the largest one in Babylonia.
The name Babel or Babylon according to us/my assoc seems similiar to the name Byblos (bible/papyrus; tho more correctly Gebal).
Babylon was supposed to have been built by the god Marduk. Babylon was depicted at the center of the known world in ancient clay maps. The Babel name and catastrophe seem similar to the Bab-el-Mandeb name and catastrophe of Arab myth. Rohl places the original Babel / Nunki as being at Eridu and not Babylon.
Now according to us/my co-author his theory is that Babel which was after the great flood, was the equivalent of Enoch city before the flood. Why? one reason is because the Book of Enoch has Babel before the flood.
Some believe that Babel, or Babylon (and the Hanging gardens), is located on the site of Eden spoken of in the Bible.

(2.) Borsippa:
Borsippa according to us certainly cannot be ruled out as a good possible location for The Tower of Babel, because of (a) the name given to the nearby city of Babylon, (b) the meaning of “Tongue Tower”, (c) the name Birs-Nimrud, (d) Nebuchadnezzar‘s inscription statement, and (e) the vitrification traces.
The names of Sippar and Borsippa may/not be related.

(3.) Eridu/Urdu:
Eridu’s name is thought to be connected with the preflood city of Irad or Jared. Eridu is pictured as the center of world in one myth. However the researcher L A Waddell dubiously claims, that there was an older Eridu/Urda at Carchemish.
There was a counterpart of Eridu (&/or the Erythrean sea) in the west as the Erythrea city in Spain (&/or the Atlantic being called the Eythrean sea in ancient times). Eridu may or may not be connected with the names Urartu, Ararat, Aratta, (Akkad was called Urdhu & Euphrates river was called Urudtuv (compare Eridanus / Jordan).)
My associate goes on to say that he thinks there was an Edin at / by or near Eridu [~Nod?], (~ the one faught over by Lagas & Umma?). Eridu was built on apsu by Ea.
The names Eridu, Uruk, etc are thought by some to share the same root/element/syllable. Rohl reckons that the original Babel / Nunki was actually Eridu not Babylon.
The lake/sea/river that the anc Tower of Babel was built near or beside in some acounts may in fact be the Persian Gulf.

(4.) Nunki // Unuk:
My co-author says he has a theory that Babel was after the flood, and is the equivalent to Enoch city before the flood, the book of Enoch suggesting that Babel was before the flood; Then he goes on to say that Nunki resembles Unuk / Enoch.
Just like Janicula / Janiculum vaguely resembles Enoch. But Erech / Uruk is usually supposed to be Enoch//Unuk. There are claims made by Rohl as to Babel / Nunki really being Eridu and not Babylon.

In Genesis there are 2 separate accounts mentioning Babel, one in ch 10 and other one in ch 11, which everyone rightly or wrongly assumes are refering to the same thing. Tho there is a vague possibilty that the 2 genesis accounts not necessarily even be connected?
The seeming correspondence of the genesis 11 account city names Babel, Erech & Accad (+ Shinar) with the city names of Babylon, Uruk and Agade/Akkad (+ Shumer) in anc Babylonia would seem to bind/tie the location(s) to this region.

(1.) Babel/Babylon: see above.

(2.) Erech/Uruk:
Post flood Erech is supposed to be the same as pre-flood Enoch.
My assoc goes on to say that he thinks source/s say that classical Haran or Edessa / Urfa was also called Orchoe.
The land of Accadia was Uri-ki in Sumerian, which is perhaps the origin of modern day Iraq, rather than it being from Uruk / Erech.
The names Eridu, Uruk, etc are thought by some to share the same root or syllable or element.

(3.) Agade/Accad/Akkad:
The actual location of the ancient city of Akkad is uncertain to say the least, and according to my assoc still remains a mystery to this day, a mystery that is even being debated as we speak. However from what other researchers have indicated from their research they feel that like myself, that the city of Akkad was possibly Sippar, or rather the twin half of the city located on the opposite side of the river (Sepharva-im plural/dual).
Tho when compared to modern cities of today, Agade/Akkad could be Baghdad (Pekod?), although orthodox etymology of the latter may suggest that this is not true. The land of Accadia was Uri-ki in ancient Sumerian.

Now the four cities of Nimrod in Shinar, may possibly match five cities said to exist before the flood given in some text as Nunki/Eridu, Sippar, Shurupak, Larak, and Badtabira, (also compare with 4 Rivers of Eden).

(1.) Nunki: see above.

(2.) Eridu: see above.

(3.) Sippar:
My associate goes on to say that he thinks that some authors claim that akkad city was Sippar, or the half / twin located on the other side of the river (Sepharvaim). Names of Sippar and Borsippa may/not be connected.

The seven or eight cities (depending on interpretation or translation) of Nimrod in seem to match the seven cities found in other myths, and apparently compare with/to the 7 hills of Rome, the seven sages, the seven Cainite gens, the 7 stage ziggurats, and/or the eight kings in power before the great flood of Sum k lists.

Nimrod is corresponded by some to any/all of:
Enmerkar/Gilgamesh (Uruk), Sargon (Akkad), Hammurabi (Babylon); Asshur/Ashur/Assur (Assyria); Ninus (Nineveh).

The 4 or 3 (dep on bib transl) cities of Assyria are disputed whether built by Nimrod or Asshur depending on bibl translation.

(1) Resen:
May perhaps be the city of Larissa said to have been built by Nimrod?

Joseph's Famine

2007-04-05T22:06:00.000+01:00

-> Judaeo-Xtian version: Joseph/Paneah vizier during 7 yrs plenty/storage and then 7 yrs world drought/famine.
-> Hittite version: Telipinu disappeared, trees withered, springs dried up, famine crept over world.
-> Phoenician versions: Mot slays Baal, 7 yrs drought/sterility. Salem & Sahar huge appetites, spend 7 yrs amoung crops/pasture while food accumulates in barns. Danel puts 7 yr curse on earth. Drought Keret (2 wives, 7 sons). (Ref: A Millard, Larousse, Hutchinson.)
-> Yemeni version: . (Ref: G Jeffreys/ies.)
-> Assyrio-Babylonian version: Epic of Gilgamesh "7 yrs drought ... have you saved grain ... I have saved grain ... for 7 yrs". Atrahasis epic ".... Let the fig tree be cut off from the people; in their bellies let vegetables be wanting. Above let Adad make scarce his rain....[there then followed 7 harsh yrs/periods/series of famine.]" "Would that famine had wasted the world rather than the flood." "In later Sumerian as in old Babylonian writings flood and deluge are sent by the gods along with equally catastropic visitations of plague, drought and famiine." Descent of Ishtar (dry, dusty, vizier, 7 gates/judges), on earth springs of fertility ran dry, Ea secured her release by means of a brilliant eunuch which captivated the heart of the mistress of infertility & death. (Refs: NK Sandars, A Tomas, A Alford, Cotterell.)
-> Sum-Akk: 12 yrs drought/famine during late Guti dyn/period [prob not jose's one unless 12 is for doubled 6?].
-> Iranian versions: During the reign of Afrasiyab, king of Turan, over Persia, it did not rain for 8 years. Drought betw Anau 2-Susa 2.
-> Indian versions: Indra vs Vritra/drought. Once the earth was deprived of moisture, Ganges washing only sky, land filled with ashes, to put an end to this terrible drought ... sought to bring the Ganges out of heaven. [12 yrs famine priest Viswa-mitra]. (Ref: E Sykes, Larousse.)
-> China: In his [Ch'en T'ang's] reign China suffered from seven years of famine, shortly before that of Egypt (H Hoeh.)
-> Chinese version: Huangti brought down Pa/dryness who stopped wind & rain, Pa couldn't go back, continued to spread drought, people suffered grtly. (Ref: Larousse.)

-> Egyptian version: 7 yrs drought during Djoser's reign. 7 empty years Mentuhotep 4 (11th dyn, or 12th?) Perhaps cp 2 droughts supposedly between end of last ice age and 1st Egyptian dynasty. 7 cows Hathor. 7 ears corn Isis [Virgo]. A king of 9th dyn was Kaneferre (Chenephres?), a famine in his reign. Unas famine scenes.
-> Ethiopian: "the country that Anayer had come from had been afflicted by 7 yrs of famine (Hancock).
-> Bambara version: Faro (vs Teliko/desert wind) came to earth after long period of drought during which most living things died? (Ref: M Jordan.)
-> Yoruba: Ifa left earth whereupon famine descended.
-> Rhodesian: "then Mwuetsi sickened: rain didn't fall, plants withered, streams ran dry, animals and people died."

-> Greek versions: abduction of Persephone, life shrivels & dies, dry summer, grain stored in silos, Demeter wanders earth. "During the 7 yrs that followed not a drop of rain fell in Thera, & every tree on the isl, except 1, withered & died." Some see a similarity betw Jose & Thales.
-> Evolutionist versions: Egyptian wheat found in Lake Dwellings built on dried up lake shores. Geological period (lost name) when most seas considerably dried up.

-> Peru: deluge followed by a famine (tho this could also/alt be the lack of food after flood).

-> Toltec: Tollan stricken by drought & then famine, all rivers and wells dry up, grainaries invaded by vermin. (Pears.)
-> Mexico: 4th age great famine prevailed (DA MacKenzie.)
-> Huron Indian vers: Tsenta made life poss on earth by defeating the Great Frog which had swallowed all the (deluge) waters and returning them to the rivers and valleys.
-> Cherokee: Sun-goddess hated people and cursed them with a great drought (Flem-Ath.)

- Judaeo-Xtian version: Joseph & Potiphar's wife. Jesus tempted by Devil.
- Mesopotamian versions: epic of Gilgamesh, Gilgamesh turns down Ishtar. Descent of Ishtar (dry, dusty, vizier, 7 gates/judges, on earth springs of fertility ran dry), Ea secured her release by means of a brilliant Eunuch which captivated the heart of the mistress of infertility & death. (Sandars, Massey.)
- Phoenic: Aqhat refuses to give bow to the goddess (tho not quite the same), (Larouse).
- Combabus solicited by [Syria-Dea?] (Lucian, G Massey.)
- Classical: chaste Virbius spurned love of women, Aphrodite stung by his scorn, disdained stepmother Phaedra, she falsely accused him to his father, sea-god sent bull from waves (G Frazer.)
- Egyptian version: "the tale of two brothers" (Bata and Anpu's wife, date 6th dyn/mid kdm?), (Keller, .)
- Amerind: Akaiyan & Nopatsis wife [also even with a Benjamin parallel], (L Spence).

The orthodox establishment places Jose in hyksos times (15th/16th dyn), while Rohl's "new chronology" places Joseph in 12th (or 11th?) dyn.

12th dyn is too late for Joseph who was only 3rd after Abram (generations in between Abe to Jose were only 2) who was only (1)400 yrs after flood just after extreme longevity, at beginnings of history.

Joseph and Moses can't both be so close together re (11th)/12th/(13th) dyn(s).

The Egyptians attached special significance to the ideal age of 110 yrs, which is the age Joseph died at.

Shechem is founded in the time of Jacob in bible (except for anachronistic mention in Abraham's time). The town is mentioned in the 12th dyn of Egypt, meaning Jacob must come before (or contemp with) 12th dyn.

Asenath (~Arsinoe???) elements may be Aso/Isis/(Sais), Neith?

Various possible elements Potiphar:
p-, Put/Buto/Bata/Ptah, Pharaoh/Phra/p(e)r-/Af-Ra, Har/Horus, Ra.

Joseph has been variously compared with Osar-siph (Sayce), Peteseph (Cheremon), Inyotef (Rohl?), Djoser (B Walker), Souphis (Hoeh), and/or [(bay/bey) ~ ya-seph ~ irsu ~ (Yuya)].

Given the clear proof (above) that Joseph's famine really was world-wide as bible says (contrary to seeming opinion), Joseph must correspond with a period/date in Egyptian history that has a global atmosphere such as the 4th dynasty not like [15/16 &/or 12/11].

(Verses imply united kingdom and not 2 or more contemp ks/dyns as some theorise?)

A certain officer Ra-hotep [Hotep-ra?] of ca 3rd dyn was chief priest of On, and leader of warriors of the monarch.
The name and offices are vaguely similar to either/both the biblical Potiphera priest of On whose daughter Joseph married, and/or to the officer Potiphar captain of the royal guard whose wife tried to get Joseph to lie with her. (Could famous Rahotep's wife Nefert/Nofret "beautiful/good" actually be Potiphar's wife or the mother of Asenath? Tradition would have it that the name of Potiphar's wife was Zuleika/Zelicah [compare Queen Dalukah?])
Other names also/alt similar are Hotep-dif 2nd dyn priest,
Ptah-hotep 5th dyn, (some would add Djedefre).

The bent pyramid attributed to time of about Sneferu (3/4 dyn) could represent the 7 yrs plenty and 7 yrs scarcity. (Bent pyr connected with: 3.5 pi (half of 7), St Joseph, Joseph's canal.) Other hitherto theories were that it (&/or Meydum pyr) was due to disaster/rain/quake, or [dual/Seth] (A Alford.)
(Less likely, perhaps Joseph was even entombed in bent pyramid (explaining why Sneferu allegdedly had 2 or 3 pyramids?) and the rough hewn tunnel hacked thru masonry is from Moses removing his bones???)

Anc Egyptian feudal period (4-15 dyn) may be connected with Joseph's state.

Also/alt, king Pepy/Phiops (6th) dynasty was a centenarian like Joseph & Moses. Djedi the 4th dyn magician lived 110 yrs.

Philitis the shepherd of 4th dyn might be Hebrews, as a people rather than person?
Hebrews were captive shepherds [of Egyptian records/traditions?] not (Hyksos) king shepherds.

Gos(h)en (cp Gozan)/Gesem (LXX/Sept): Kessan (Artapanus):
Faqus/Phacussa/Qesem (Rohl), Feshn (kh/f intchge), Sesen (s/k, sh/kh intchge), Goseir (n/r intchge), Casius, Giza/Gizeh (cp Gaza), Gosu/Cusae ("too far south"), Gesy/Qus, Kush/Kesh, Kahun.

(Joseph sold for money a type of Jesus sold for money.)

Abraham ~ Uenephes/Semenptah (1st dyn) :
- (famine -> plagues);
Jacob ~ Nynetjer/Necherophes (2nd dyn) :
- (Shechem ~ Shem-Re????, "terror");
Joseph ~ (betw Zoser to) Sneferu (3/4 dyn) :
- (famine Zoser?, bent pyramid, Rahotep, global);
Moses ~ 12th dyn :
- (12 springs, slave workers?, brick buildings, temple Atum, new kdm/dyn/king, giant?, ....)